Some thoughts on WCOAP 2015

[3N1GM4]

Originally posted this on FB as a response to Des, but it become a bit longer than I"d originally intended, so thought I"d post it here too and see what people think. Just my musings, so please do tear them down if what I"m saying is utter balls.

I"m sure this is something that Des and the team will have thought about and looked into already, but are there a few potential ways to bring the costs down for some/many/all of those attending?

Firstly, what about trying to partner with a local hotel (the Holiday Inn next to the casino, Travelodge down the high street or similar) and get a reduced rate for the period of WCOAP? I"m sure APAT could bring in enough people to make it worthwhile for the hotel, although perhaps on an Easter weekend they don"t need any help filling their rooms. This is why we always tend to book a flat/cottage of some kind for APAT events now (props to Dave Batman Howard for his accommodation booking tekkers).

Secondly, it would be nice to see more satellites for WCOAP events, both online and live (if possible, probably not). Perhaps there were some and I missed them, or they weren"t advertised or pushed very hard, but I wasn"t aware of any way I could sat into events, or better yet, win some kind of mega package (high enough value to play most/all events). I think this would offer an option to those of us who really can"t financially justify such a significant number of tournaments in a short period. You could run some kind of online league throughout the year to accumulate the prize pool for this, or just score points off the National Online Events through the season and skim a little off the prize pool to pay for a couple of packages or something. Obviously not entirely thought through, but you get the idea.

Finally, drink prices at Aspers are absolutely ridic. £5 for a pint is pricey even for London and it makes a massive difference to those of us who enjoy a beer or seven. I believe that the reason for the price increase was the issues the venue had previously with drunken behaviour and so now only locals/regs with the requisite players club level get reduced alcohol (more like £3 I believe) in an effort to prevent randoms coming in, getting pissed and smashing the place up. Now while I"m not saying that APATers never get a bit loud after a few jars, I"ve certainly never heard of any of us causing serious trouble at an event, so it would be nice for next year (if we"re at Aspers for the WCOAP again as I suspect we will be) we could negotiate some kind of discounted drinks deal for APAT members. I know for a fact I spent less on booze than I would have if the drinks were cheaper as it just wasn"t worth drinking every day if I could only have one or two (let"s forget about the couple of nights where I definitely had more than one or two - I know I"ve forgotten!).

So there you go, didn"t intend for this to be a massive reply and I have to echo the sentiments of everyone else in thanking Des, Tom, Dann, Paulie and everyone else who made the series so enjoyable, despite a severe lack of results for myself. Roll on next year!

[Paulie_D]

Firstly, what about trying to partner with a local hotel (the Holiday Inn next to the casino, Travelodge down the high street or similar) and get a reduced rate for the period of WCOAP? I"m sure APAT could bring in enough people to make it worthwhile for the hotel, although perhaps on an Easter weekend they don"t need any help filling their rooms.

I did suggest this to both Des and Tom and it"s something that will have to be looked at.

As you say, the hotels don"t seem to have any troubles filling their rooms so any discounts might be problematical but until you ask you don"t know.

The other "issue" is, of course, that APAT would probably have to guarantee a set number of rooms AND, quite possibly, pay in advance...and that"s going to be an issue.

THEN you"d be getting into APAT having to, effectively, sell those rooms on (presumably on a per night basis as not everyone would want to stay for the whole two weeks 10 days) and that adds another layer of complexity and booking arrangements.

Is it doable...probably, but it"s not an easy matter when you get down to the nitty-gritty.

Perhaps, as I mentioned, we could start a Room Share / House Share board for not only the WCOAP but other events too?

[Paulie_D]

Finally, drink prices at Aspers are absolutely ridic. £5 for a pint is pricey even for London and it makes a massive difference to those of us who enjoy a beer or seven. I believe that the reason for the price increase was the issues the venue had previously with drunken behaviour and so now only locals/regs with the requisite players club level get reduced alcohol (more like £3 I believe) in an effort to prevent randoms coming in, getting pissed and smashing the place up. Now while I"m not saying that APATers never get a bit loud after a few jars, I"ve certainly never heard of any of us causing serious trouble at an event, so it would be nice for next year (if we"re at Aspers for the WCOAP again as I suspect we will be) we could negotiate some kind of discounted drinks deal for APAT members. I know for a fact I spent less on booze than I would have if the drinks were cheaper as it just wasn"t worth drinking every day if I could only have one or two (let"s forget about the couple of nights where I definitely had more than one or two - I know I"ve forgotten!).

Again, this didn"t go unnoticed (or unmentioned) and, assuming that APAT continue to use Aspers for the WCOAP, then perhaps other arrangements can be made.

Maybe a separate tournament area with it"s own bar (and adjusted pricing)?

Perhaps a wristband system (as is used at the LPPL) for APAT players (how this would operate for partners etc. I"m not sure but nothing is impossible)?

Alternatively, a special Aspers card along the same lines?

[Paulie_D]

Along the same lines, and I"ve seen this come up on FB, parking at Westfields

£6 a day and £9.50 at weekends.

I thought I heard some mention that Aspers could "validate" this and thus parking would be free...but I haven"t seen it mentioned anywhere else.

Can anyone confirm the rumour(?)...and perhaps we could add it to the list of things that we could want looked into for, what I presume would be WCOAP 2016?

[dwh103]

Along the same lines, and I"ve seen this come up on FB, parking at Westfields

£6 a day and £9.50 at weekends.

I thought I heard some mention that Aspers could "validate" this and thus parking would be free...but I haven"t seen it mentioned anywhere else.

Can anyone confirm the rumour(?)...and perhaps we could add it to the list of things that we could want looked into for, what I presume would be WCOAP 2016?

Think this is for Gold card holders only.

[luther101]

Just a few musings after playing my first APAT Festival in years    ....

1) Westfield daily parking charges are simply too high - and the weekend ones made me wince.

2) Aspers drinks prices (even soft drinks) are bordering rip off status.

3) Importantly some of the tournament were just laughable - Razz/PLO8/HORSE (they totally ruined it for several of us who had reserved seats early, expecting some decent mixed game comps)   ....    the structures were so wrong & played as though they were dreamed up on the "back of a fag packet" ten minutes before the start.

Hopefully these could be looked at     ....      I doubt I"ll be "rushing back".

[hi_am_chris]

What was bad about the PLO8?

[Paulie_D]

the structures were so wrong & played as though they were dreamed up on the "back of a fag packet" ten minutes before the start.

Those structures have been worked on over a number of years and have been well received by those APATers who like to play these games regularly.

They"re timed to run over a certain length of time...as much as one can calculate these things so the starting stack might fluctuate usually upwards.

Plus...it"s a £50 comp...not the WSOP.  

[Jon MW]

...
Plus...it"s a £50 comp...not the WSOP.  

Wasn"t one of the founding principles of APAT to provide a "properly" structured tournament for a recreational level buy-in?

A minor point because I completely agree that the main issue is that the tournament has a certain amount of time to run in and the structure of the limit games in particular has to be such that it is so that it can fit in this time.

[Paulie_D]

...
Plus...it"s a £50 comp...not the WSOP.  

Wasn"t one of the founding principles of APAT to provide a "properly" structured tournament for a recreational level buy-in?

A minor point because I completely agree that the main issue is that the tournament has a certain amount of time to run in and the structure of the limit games in particular has to be such that it is so that it can fit in this time.

True Jon...but my opinion is that these comps ARE properly structured.

My point was that at some point quality is going to be impacted by cost....APAT does pretty well in avoiding that for the most part....but you can"t please everyone I guess.