Killer hand in $2.5m G'tee - Comments ...

[Honeybadg]

... if he shoves ... do you call?

L

[George2Loose]

After three betting yes

[Honeybadg]

... same if one of those to act after me re-raises ... in some sort of hideous squeeze ...

L

[George2Loose]

I don"t know what the stack sizes are like but once you 3 bet you can"t really fold. Their range is probably QQ+ AK.

Don"t get me wrong Louis- I don"t mind the call. However making the call to keep the pot small and then shoving an 8 high flop doesn"t make sense.

I would flat the c-bet and re-evaluate on the turn.

Also if you flat pre- someone is more likely to try and squeeze both of you out with a bigger range.

[Honeybadg]

... all criticism taken, appreciated and digested ...

I don"t like the call really(on reflection) ... I think it is an all in for me ... because there is no re-raise I can fold to.

Good poker ...

What are you playing tonight?

L

[George2Loose]

Nowt- updating my blog which I"ll get done soon hopefully- playing a fullish schedule 2moz including laddies 550$ final for a 5k WSOP package which I sattied into for 50 bucks

[Honeybadg]

... how many likely runners and packages for that Ladbrokes thing ... which event is it to ... or can you choose?

Might play a $100 STG as an unofficial satelitte ...

Likely a few of my mates will be around ... to fold their JJs!

L

[George2Loose]

Its 5500$ package. You get 7 nights at Caesars plus spendo. You then get 3 chances to qualify for the main event.

Think they"re doing this instead of packages straight into the main event

[deanp27]

its a 3bet and shove spot. Trouble with flatting is that you could let allsorts of hands get in behind you (in the blinds etc) and i think JJ is strong enough to felt with here.

[noble1]

as played to flop - call and re-evaluate on turn there is no need to end the pot on the flop - [only go all in if you are certain you are ahead and that villain will call it,you need to extract value]

all situations in poker are player read based as is how do you think your opponents view you...knowing how your image appears to others is important in your decision making post flop...it is good being aware of your opponents ranges but useless if you cannot re-evaluate on the streets according to your opponents actions,betting and previous bet patterns...

as said in previous posts above by going all in on the flop [a massive over bet] all you guarantee is that if called it will be by a hand that is beating you...

He thought about this for a while and said he would fold the jacks ... (and has done in similar positions) ... his best win is c$40k ... this was the last thing on my mind at the time ... but I think it does make sense ... no risk ... (and at the time no risk required) ... wait for a spot to make the running or for a bigger hand.

wowser    is folding jacks good? to a loose ep raiser? [your read] and if you flat call him with a tight image would not a good thinking player see that as possibly a big hand? and leading his set like a basic continuation bet is the perfect way to disguise it [loose image] you played your over pair BAD , try to play the streets a bit more if you are still not sure of his range  [you still have plenty play in your stack] i"d suggest you work on trying to control the pot sizes when unsure where you are in a hand, you have position...

read this !! it will give you something to think about as to how far you think you are on reading players and situations.http://www.pokerplayermagazine.co.uk/advancedplay/holdem/1739/playing_the_turn.html

http://www.apat.com/forum/index.php?topic=2316.msg38585#msg38585 - am i wrong to fold here based on the betting actions?

as you may now be experiencing when you are in the 22 to 30bb stack size area it is difficult to play without a good read and 3bets pre with marginal strong hands are best if you think your opponent will fold , YOU are not hoping for a call really !!,and forget shoving 30bb all in pre , that is just weak spewy [note any player if you witness them shoving to steal with 25bb + as like your hand JJ it is usually a bad play with a marginally strong hand or worse]

also a bra on the head works wonders   online or live   lol lol i just wanted to get in my bra on head advice   sorry  

work on your reading of others pre and post flop and your game will improve...

[Morethanluck]

Louis

I"m far from being an expert, but thought I"d add my thoughts - you"ve done the same for me before!

I"ve deliberately not read all of the other comments in advance.

I think your stack size makes this a really difficult decision.  I don"t think you can call because you don"t have the implied odds to make it profitable - just under 8 times his raise - you"d need to be 100% sure you would double up if you hit a set, which is unlikely.  If you call, what flop without a jack do you like and what do you do in each case if - all lower than J and he bets? Or overcards which will come about 60% of the time?  I don"t think you would know where you are in either case.

That leaves pushing or folding.  If you push you are probably only being called by a hand that beats you, or best case AK for a race.

For a tournamanet this size and a not desperate stack size of over 30BBs, I think a fold would be my choice, but perhaps I"m too tight in these situations as I tend to try to preserve my tournamant life and wait for a better spot.

I"ll go and read the other comments to see if my analysis is going to be slaughtered for being too tight!

Cheers.

Craig

[Morethanluck]

Just read the comments - looks like I"m in a "tight" minority!  I expect my blinds to be stolen from everywhere in future APAT events!