Satellite or Clickfest?

[Mikeyboy9361]

Last night I played in the $10 +$1 sat for the WCOAP thing, and have to say it was a great tournament, we got to the final table with still plenty of play after 3 and a half hours. I donked my chips off from a handy 4th place to out in 9th in two consecutive hands! Doh. Great value for money if you are playing poker for the fun of the game.
Any way, this got me thinking, I do play primarily for enjoyment, but after nearly 4 hours and a 9th place finish I came away with nothing, and so that got me thinking about how the seats are allocated for the big live events.
I think I saw some where that there are 200 seats for this event? Well if that is the case if there are only approx 25  satellite seats that leaves 175 for fastest finger. Is that right? I missed the clickfest for Cardiff, and will 95% miss it again on Thursday, surely it would be fairer to give more seats in the Sats. In last nights Sat the 5 qualifiers got a $200 package, lets face it we are playing for a seat, and we don"t care too much about the extra $100, so why don"t we award 10 seats ( in this event) and say 25 in the more expensive buy in. This gets the ratios nearer and still allows people to click fest in if they can"t play the sats or are unlucky.
Interested to hear other thoughts?

[cincicrappykid]

i agree with this, also the clickfest on thursday is for the main event? how do we enter the side events is it all on the same nite?

:as: kc me on 24k
ad qh mickey allin 8k hits straight   grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr  

[Chipaccrual]

i agree with this, also the clickfest on thursday is for the main event? how do we enter the side events is it all on the same nite?

:as: kc me on 24k
ad qh mickey allin 8k hits straight   grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr  

Main Event Clickfest 19th March
Omaha Clickfest 20th March
Horse Clickfest 21st March

All at 9pm on the homepage of www.apat.com

[Mikeyboy9361]

Not only did I take your Chips Cinci, but some ine elses as well, it was an obvious value call!!!

[cincicrappykid]

yeah u had to move there but yyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy me arrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh  
im ok now  
thanx for intell   :as: da nuts  

[Jon MW]

...
I think I saw some where that there are 200 seats for this event? Well if that is the case if there are only approx 25  satellite seats that leaves 175 for fastest finger. Is that right? I missed the clickfest for Cardiff, and will 95% miss it again on Thursday, surely it would be fairer to give more seats in the Sats. ...

If you take seats away from the clickfest and give them to the satellites that makes it easier for you to get a seat.

So that"s what you mean by fair?

Because there are several people who either don"t play as well online, or who aren"t so good at satellites or who don"t play online poker at all.

Why is it fairer to make it easier for you to get a seat when it would make it harder for them to get one?

After all, these are live events.

So surely live players should be well represented.

[Mikeyboy9361]

No I am not saying that, fair would be 50% clickfest, and 50% satellite. That is fair surely.

[Jon MW]

No I am not saying that, fair would be 50% clickfest, and 50% satellite. That is fair surely.

So the people who play online can

1. Try to win a satellite for 50% of the seats and if they fail
2. Try to get a seat (from 50%) through the clickfest

But the people who don"t play online can

1. Try to get a seat (from 50%) through the clickfest.


How is that fair for online players to get 2 chances for a seat to a live event

but live players only get 1 chance for a seat to a live event?

[Chipaccrual]

No I am not saying that, fair would be 50% clickfest, and 50% satellite. That is fair surely.

With the numbers we get for the satellites though, a 50/50 split would mean the satellites would be as good as a direct buy-in.

For a normal National event

$20 satellite = 1 seat in 7.5
$10 satellite = 1 seat in 15
$5 rebuy = Nornally around 1 seat in 10 at worst

At the moment we offer a reasonable range of satellite methods to meet most people buy-in"s.

[Swinebag]

i pretty much agree with Jons point. We dont want to be going down the virgin festival route.

But mikes point about reducing the expenses is valid.

£100 (the buy in for the main event) is pretty much $140 at the moment, so a $200 win in a sat gives $60 expenses.

I believe the overlay in prize is because BSQ have to account for fluctuations in the value of the pound against the dollar. Surely a prize of $160 would be enough to take this into account and would create a few more seats.

For other nationals (£75 buy in) the satellite prize is $150 where £75 gives $105 dollars. I"d imagine a prize of $120 would cover fluctuations in the money market adequately and would also create a few more seats.

[Jon MW]

i pretty much agree with Jons point. We dont want to be going down the virgin festival route.

But mikes point about reducing the expenses is valid.

£100 (the buy in for the main event) is pretty much $140 at the moment, so a $200 win in a sat gives $60 expenses.

I believe the overlay in prize is because BSQ have to account for fluctuations in the value of the pound against the dollar. Surely a prize of $160 would be enough to take this into account and would create a few more seats.

For other nationals (£75 buy in) the satellite prize is $150 where £75 gives $105 dollars. I"d imagine a prize of $120 would cover fluctuations in the money market adequately and would also create a few more seats.

Wait, I"m in danger of sounding argumentative.

I think you"re right the extra money probably is just to account for currency fluctuations.

But I don"t think you can assume some people don"t appreciate the little bit extra, even if it"s only enough to pay a train fare for example rather than any substantial part of their expenses.

[Swinebag]

But I don"t think you can assume some people don"t appreciate the little bit extra, even if it"s only enough to pay a train fare for example rather than any substantial part of their expenses.

I"m sure they don"t not appreciate the extra money. I"m also sure they would still play the satellites, with no complaints, if the prize was smaller and gave less expenses.

[Mikeyboy9361]

In my initial thread I wasn"t actually advocating a 50/50 split, that was just playing Devils advocate in response to Jons first post.
But surely a larger number of Sat seats, where actual poker skill is involved, would be better than the crapshoot that is the clickfest.
Also Jon your argument about not playing on line, so not having those seats available to you are just the same as mine, when unable to make the click fest!
On Thursday, I will be at a big corporate bash in Birmingham, and I will be trying to sneak away at 9pm just to try and fast finger, but I don"t really know if that will be possible.

[Jon MW]

...
Also Jon your argument about not playing on line, so not having those seats available to you are just the same as mine, when unable to make the click fest!
On Thursday, I will be at a big corporate bash in Birmingham, and I will be trying to sneak away at 9pm just to try and fast finger, but I don"t really know if that will be possible.

But we"re not just talking about one person and one event. Some people may only be able to qualify by satellite - hence putting them in the same position as those who can only get a seat by the clickfest.

But most of the people who can qualify by satellite can also get in through the clickfest - whereas none of the players who don"t play online can get a seat through the satellite.


Also if you put more seats into the satellites you benefit online players

If you put more seats into the clickfest you benefit live players.

As we are trying to get seats into a live event - if you have to choose one, doesn"t it make sense that you tilt it towards the live players?

[AMRN]

i pretty much agree with Jons point. We dont want to be going down the virgin festival route.

But mikes point about reducing the expenses is valid.

£100 (the buy in for the main event) is pretty much $140 at the moment, so a $200 win in a sat gives $60 expenses.

I believe the overlay in prize is because BSQ have to account for fluctuations in the value of the pound against the dollar. Surely a prize of $160 would be enough to take this into account and would create a few more seats.

For other nationals (£75 buy in) the satellite prize is $150 where £75 gives $105 dollars. I"d imagine a prize of $120 would cover fluctuations in the money market adequately and would also create a few more seats.

My thoughts exactly. $60 overlay for expenses isnt going to help much - it won"t pay for a a hotel room for example.  However for every 2 $60 overlays, they could award an extra player a seat - and after all, the reason we play the satellites is for a seat - not to cover expenses. 

Would be nice if those who made final table of a satellite where the prize pool only pays 5 seats like last night could be given first refusal in the ClickFest (of course I would say that!)