Biggish early hand at Euro's - thoughts please?

[WYoung83]

 Steve you had all those outs and couldnt even hit a barn door? I know the feeling by the way. Its happened to me quite a bit on the cash tables. I flop a open-ended straight flush draw, and still miss......

[MintTrav]

you need 32% winning chance to call, and you had around 33-35% with what the pot is offering.

It"s a tournament, not a cash game.

[WYoung83]

 I know this of course. Havent you read anything by Gus hansen? He is a great tourny player, there are lots of examples like this in his aussie millions book, and he ironically, is a really really really really bad cash game player....

[MintTrav]

Mmmmm, friendly! So does Gus recommend getting half our stack in on the flop with the belief that we have 9 outs while not knowing if our hand is good if we do hit?

[deanp27]

generally you should make +EV decisions in tournaments just the same as you would in a cash game. However it is fine to turn down small edges in high variance spots if you want to play a lower variance game, which alot of players do in live tournaments as opposed to online.

[WYoung83]

 In the Aussie millions, within 6-7 hands delt, he had lost half of his stack. In one episdoe of PAD, he lost his whole stack on the 5th hand "i had a pair" were his exact words as he exited. He is someone who is either gonna get chipped up early and make a good run, or go bust trying and then simply move onto the next tourney. This is why he gets so many walks in tourneys, because people are to scared to play against him, because they cant put him on a hand.

But to answer your question MintTrav, i think it all depends on how deep you are in the situation at hand, weather you have a competetive stack to be able to out play or bluff opponents (like 3 barrel bluffs etc). Ive noticed recently that, (and this is in my opion) having 100BBs is no way deep enough to play creative poker. So i guess in steves case he should of been willing to gamble.

[George2Loose]

One mistake people make in tournaments is this idea of a "tournament life"

Generally speaking, but not always, decisions are either +EV or not. And you should be taking the EV route whether you"re risking your "tournament life" or not.

[kinboshi]

OK, on a similar theme - here"s a hand I managed to mangle in Luton.

Fairly early on, definitely one of the first two levels.  Got a player two to my right who is very aggressive (played in the German team), and he seems to be enjoying himself.

I"m the BB with  ad kd.  Foggy is UTG+1 and puts in a standard raise.  the German calls, and I decide to flat call as well (I usually raise here with AK, but like to vary things).

Flop is  qd jd .  That"s not an altogether bad flop for me .

I lead out for about pot (think it was a bet of 400).  Foggy raises to 1,200.  The German then re-raises to 2,800.

What do you do?

[AMRN]

OK, on a similar theme - here"s a hand I managed to mangle in Luton.

Fairly early on, definitely one of the first two levels.  Got a player two to my right who is very aggressive (played in the German team), and he seems to be enjoying himself.

I"m the BB with  ad kd.  Foggy is UTG+1 and puts in a standard raise.  the German calls, and I decide to flat call as well (I usually raise here with AK, but like to vary things).

Flop is  qd jd .  That"s not an altogether bad flop for me .

I lead out for about pot (think it was a bet of 400).  Foggy raises to 1,200.  The German then re-raises to 2,800.

What do you do?

hate to admit it, but i think i probably spew all my chips here

[Marty719]

How many chips do u have?

[deanp27]

call pre is 100% best play imo

i wouldn"t lead the flop though, i would check raise but job done anyway - arrrrr innnn

[kinboshi]

How many chips do u have?

Maybe 9,000.  German has me covered, and Foggy is somewhere between the two.

[Marty719]

Insta ship - u still have fold equity here.  Im bout 50/50 pre but I guess u know ur gna have to play outa position.  Tbh - I think if u lead out here u have to be prepared to get it in.  B/f"n this spot wud suck!

[WYoung83]

 Once heard a comment from phill gordon. he says if you flop a monster draw, look to play a massive pot as soon as possible. because if you hit a diamond on the turn, it gives your opponent enough oportunity to escape out of harms way especially if he has somthing like 2 pair. But if the pot is bigger on the flop, you will be able to play for stacks on a later street.
The worst case secaniro if you play a big pot with a monster draw like this, he would be willing to go all the way with a set, and you have around 12 outs. So never really a big underdog at worst anyway.

[JamieCarra]

I don"t particularly like it, but with a guaranteed 12 outs I probably shove here.  Don"t think i lead out on the flop though but it certainly isn"t dreadful