Question on ranges

[shozboy1]

Hi I have a quick question on ranges. This is a hand I played in the 20/20 sat last night - 1st hand. 2000 chips, 12min levels. 

2 limpers at the 10-20 level. The table is only 7 handed at this moment. I"m in the SB and raise to 100 (with KK edit). Pretty standard with 2 already limped into the pot. The 1st limper calls, the 2nd one calls (sorry, I dont have the hand history to post - pokertracker didnt pick my DTD game up for some reason).

Pot is now roughly 300. I bet 150 on a dry 9-7-2 board. Rainbow. The 1st player folds, the 2nd one pops me up to 900. I shove and get called by 97o. Obv brick turn and river and thats the end.

This isn"t a bad beat story, but I"m wondering if this was a bad play from me. His preflop limp/calling range is very wide here:
Ax where x could be anything from a Q downwards.
Suited connectors
Small/medium pairs 22-88
KQ/KJ/K10/K9/QJ/Q10/J10                                                                                                                               However, with the action on the flop, I can strip out alot of his range here to Ax, where x is a 9 or maybe a 7
A set of 2"s or 7"s, pocket 8"s, connectors like 9-10/8-9 and maybe 87 but unlikely. Otherwise only K9 also.
Given he"s a random and has such a wide range, I would be mathematically wrong to fold here, correct?

[shozboy1]

Actually, I just plugged this into pokerstove, and even stripping out the unlikely A7 and 78 hands, I have 62% equity so a shove, I think, was fine

[Paulie_D]

Difficult to comment without knowing what you had but when he comes over the top for 1/2 his stack...in the first hand....he"s never folding after that. Would he do that without having something that has you beat?

Tough I know with no read.

[deanp27]

dunno what you had but with the action on the flop your range sounds too wide to give you so much equity. You probably have used preflop ranges which now are narrowed because of the action on the flop, unless you have loads of weak 1 pair hands in his range

[shozboy1]

apologies for being dumb. Forgot to say I had KK

[shozboy1]

If you plug into pokerstove,
player 1 kk
player 2 A9/K9/22/77/88/99/109/10-8/89/97. This is the range I"m assigning him AFTER the flop action. Preflop obv he could have any two. It would be wrong in my opinion, to assign him a range only which has me crushed, because we dont know anything about this guy (1st hand). (If he was a nit I"d be happy to take out the A9/K9/89/109 hands, but I dont think I can do that here)

My equity comes out at 62%. These are all hands which a random (likely terrible player who limp calls a raise) could have in this spot. He might easily feel top pair is good here. He must also put me on a wide range after seeing me raise and 1/2 pot cbet into a dry board. I could have pretty much anything as cbetting is so standard

[noble1]

knowing the buy in would help also shoz..As played - no info or reads i"d give villain the hand and fold on a flop like this..
Easy to assume that villains are clueless and will spazz off Top pair or a oesd if the flops are 2suited and more connnected or are just bluffing..Patience and discipline shoz , u have time and a good stack left if u fold to get a better idea of your opponents styles and abilities which will help u to make better decisions..You have 1 pair [it is a good 1 pair, but still it is 1 pair] get into the habit of folding these if u have no info to go by..
Also do not assume villains are instantly terrible to limp call , i do it with pairs and connectors as i"m sure u do and many an APATer on here also , WHY? ,  because sometimes we hit our sets or 2pairs and stack someone over playing a big pair or AK etc when we have position on them [or not sometimes ] in the 1st level..
Your ranges are about right for a std donkament Ax o+s , 22+ , connectors , 1gappers suited or otherwise , ATC suited and broadways..
Tweak the mindset a tad dont make assumptions on unknown opponents, closely watch the table and try get a feel on them and listen to your 1st gut instinct.. [its usually right once u have been playing poker for a while]

anyhows thats what i think fwiw ...

[shozboy1]

But if its mathematically correct to go with the hand isn"t that the key thing? Because in the long run I should turn in a profit?
Playing more "correctly" from a maths point of view, is something I"ve been trying to incorporate in my game in the last few months. I understand there"s times where mathematics may dictate a call, but in the grand scheme of things, playing for all your chips may not be wise.

(It was a 17 euro 20/20 sat to DTD by the way. 10 seats guaranteed, 72 entrants.)  

p.s lets reverse the scenario here. If I folded to his raise and he showed my A9 or 88, and I"d posted the hand, what would be the responses on this board then? Would people still say its a fold?

[noble1]

Only correct if u have an idea of the opponents range and style imo shoz...
I"d still say fold is correct even if villain would be dumb enough to show a bluff or A9 etc , i"m sorry shoz but i"m never going to advise anyone to stack off 100bb"s with an over pair with no reads on a dry board like this.
Its not a very good habit to get into imo , if others reading the thread can argue the merits for always getting all in on dry flops with an overpair then by all means keep on doing it..I stopped doing it in donkaments myself as i found other ways to gain chips because as i got better at reading others i started to understand more that being in position early on in mtts was important in playing weak/bad players with their unpredictable natures..I thank Annette_15 to opening my eyes to this when i first watched her $4.40 180 man blind play it showed me how much i had to learn..
If risking early your whole stack shoz works for u then keep doing it ...

[MintTrav]

I don"t think you have 62% cos the range you are assigning him is too wide. I can"t see him making that play with some of those hands (unless he was called George2loose, by any chance?)

[cincicrappykid]

assume he is a good not a  bad player is a good way of not losing all your chips early .....

[Marty719]

Its a really dry board but I hate folding overpairs when we only start w/ 2k.  Still think its correct for this spot tho!

His bet sizing is weird but I think I like it.  Most would make it ~500 here to make it seem like there is more f/e and widen hero"s 3-bet shoving range, but what making it 900 does in this spot is take flatting away as an option.  It means if you are going to continue with any hand, it has to be for your entire stack.  I kinda like it.

[shozboy1]

Ok, I think this statement has struck a cord with me:

Only correct if u have an idea of the opponents range and style imo shoz...

Being the 1st hand I had no clue about him. I"ve been pretty sucessful at tieing up live seats in these things, and probably shuda realised that actually having a seat in this donkament to pick people off with was more important than trying to make a hero call in the 1st hand against a random