Author Topic: S4 ENGLAND - WCOAP Team Championships  (Read 50818 times)

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AMRN

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Re: ENGLAND - WCOAP Team Championships
« Reply #15 on: July 21, 2010, 21:38:44 PM »
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someone will bite


OK I"ll bite.


I also believe that with such a large pool of talent to choose from it"s wrong to pick anyone that represented England last year, to represent England this year. i.e. a once every 2 years at most rule would be a fair way of giving more of the good players their chance.


Personally I disagree. I represented my country last year, and have duly sent the captain a request for a place this year. I have based this on my recent performances and form. OK, not much APAT specific form at the moment, but then there hasn"t been too much APAT (live) opportunity for me yet this season, but my general poker form is miles ahead of where I was last year.  That said, I did consider not applying as I didn"t want to put Brian in a difficult position given that he and I are friends, and no doubt some people will claim intentions are wrong if I were lucky enough to be selected. However I want this as badly as anyone else, so chose to go ahead with an application.

To state that English selection should be based on every second year only is plain wrong - Most other teams include many repeat selections year on year, and some teams are identical year on year - why should we be penalised for being English?  

Given that the total player base of APAT is hugely biased toward England (~25%+?), it does not seem wrong to consider breaking England into North and South. That said, whilst providing fairer opportunity, it would dilute the patriotism angle.... there is only one England, and can therefore only be one England team.


Cyntaf

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Re: ENGLAND - WCOAP Team Championships
« Reply #16 on: July 21, 2010, 22:29:28 PM »
Congratulations Brian, man for the job. Av a gud un, i c u there matey. :)

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MintTrav

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Re: ENGLAND - WCOAP Team Championships
« Reply #17 on: July 21, 2010, 22:48:44 PM »

why should we be penalised for being English?  

True - you"ve suffered enough already.
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AJDUK

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Re: ENGLAND - WCOAP Team Championships
« Reply #18 on: July 21, 2010, 23:32:51 PM »

I also believe that with such a large pool of talent to choose from it"s wrong to pick anyone that represented England last year, to represent England this year. i.e. a once every 2 years at most rule would be a fair way of giving more of the good players their chance.



Personally I disagree.


Of course you disagree Steve, that"s hardly le shock de la jour. But how disappointed would you be if you had been generally quite successful in APAT terms yet overlooked for someone who took their place last year? Wouldn"t that frustrate you slightly?

As for the other nations - yes some people are a shoe in because of numbers but that could be balanced by some nations having and A + B teams and perhaps having some of the smaller nations either combined or compete every two years depending on previous years placing - I dunno (just rambling ill thought out suggestions perhaps) but I believe something should be done to ensure that more of the top English guys get their chance to play in such a unique competition.

So my bottom line suggestion is either restrict appearances or give us a B team next season.
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AMRN

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Re: ENGLAND - WCOAP Team Championships
« Reply #19 on: July 22, 2010, 14:45:24 PM »


I also believe that with such a large pool of talent to choose from it"s wrong to pick anyone that represented England last year, to represent England this year. i.e. a once every 2 years at most rule would be a fair way of giving more of the good players their chance.



Personally I disagree.


Of course you disagree Steve, that"s hardly le shock de la jour. But how disappointed would you be if you had been generally quite successful in APAT terms yet overlooked for someone who took their place last year? Wouldn"t that frustrate you slightly?

As for the other nations - yes some people are a shoe in because of numbers but that could be balanced by some nations having and A + B teams and perhaps having some of the smaller nations either combined or compete every two years depending on previous years placing - I dunno (just rambling ill thought out suggestions perhaps) but I believe something should be done to ensure that more of the top English guys get their chance to play in such a unique competition.

So my bottom line suggestion is either restrict appearances or give us a B team next season.


FWIW I have withdrawn my application. Personally I don"t see an issue - restricting selection because someone played the last game is something that happens at my 11 year old son"s cricket club - surprised people think it should happen at an international tournament event like this, but c"est la vie.... I would hate to be selected, and then find that I"m resented for it, or that Brian"s selection process is questioned....  Last thing I want to do is put Brian in any difficult situation, so to ease any pressures, I have taken myself out of his equation, and will focus on the other WCOAP events.   Disappointed, but wish whoever does make the England team all the best.

England FTW

Paulie_D

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Re: ENGLAND - WCOAP Team Championships
« Reply #20 on: July 22, 2010, 15:17:27 PM »


So my bottom line suggestion is either restrict appearances or give us a B team next season.



Personally, I disagree...and not having a shot either way, I have no axe to grind.

Selection is at the discretion of the captain and previous selection should not be a bar to being re-selected in any way shape of form.

I don"t think A & B teams are warranted either unless you are going to offer every country the option.
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Chipaccrual

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Re: ENGLAND - WCOAP Team Championships
« Reply #21 on: July 22, 2010, 15:20:52 PM »



I also believe that with such a large pool of talent to choose from it"s wrong to pick anyone that represented England last year, to represent England this year. i.e. a once every 2 years at most rule would be a fair way of giving more of the good players their chance.



Personally I disagree.


Of course you disagree Steve, that"s hardly le shock de la jour. But how disappointed would you be if you had been generally quite successful in APAT terms yet overlooked for someone who took their place last year? Wouldn"t that frustrate you slightly?

As for the other nations - yes some people are a shoe in because of numbers but that could be balanced by some nations having and A + B teams and perhaps having some of the smaller nations either combined or compete every two years depending on previous years placing - I dunno (just rambling ill thought out suggestions perhaps) but I believe something should be done to ensure that more of the top English guys get their chance to play in such a unique competition.

So my bottom line suggestion is either restrict appearances or give us a B team next season.


FWIW I have withdrawn my application. Personally I don"t see an issue - restricting selection because someone played the last game is something that happens at my 11 year old son"s cricket club - surprised people think it should happen at an international tournament event like this, but c"est la vie.... I would hate to be selected, and then find that I"m resented for it, or that Brian"s selection process is questioned....  Last thing I want to do is put Brian in any difficult situation, so to ease any pressures, I have taken myself out of his equation, and will focus on the other WCOAP events.   Disappointed, but wish whoever does make the England team all the best.

England FTW



This is fantastic news.  As a total unbiased, neutral, Welshman, I think the fact that one of the better, proven English players is withdrawing from selection process is brilliant.   ;)

On a serious point, Brian has been selected as England captain due to a number of factors which include his standing in the APAT community, his poker experiences and his passion for the English team.

To think that anyone would want to hinder his already difficult task further by suggesting he should have stipulations within his selection process really baffles me.

The APAT team event is a unique event, pitting country versus country and if you ask any of the players that have played before about it, they will only speak in glowing terms about the pride and honour of representing their country.

To suggest England should have additional teams, or players that have represented their country before shouldn"t be allowed to put themselves forward seems totally ridiculous to me.

If Brian feels that having Steve in the team would be best for the England cause, then what"s the problem ?   You have to trust in Brian"s judgement in the same way all of the countries trust in their captains picks.

They are not always right, and some of the past captains have said if they had their time again, they may pick differently (Well, that"s what Dewi said when he picked me in Season 2  ;D ), but they have been chosen to select a team to represent their country, and they should have the option to pick anyone they feel is right for the job.

It is impossible to please everyone, but at least, let"s give the captains a fair chance to make the best selections they feel they can.

That is all.   ;D

daveyb147

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Re: ENGLAND - WCOAP Team Championships
« Reply #22 on: July 22, 2010, 15:30:51 PM »
Best players should play,,end of !!!,,,,and im sure the captains will pick what they think is the best team,,,,steve,,i dont know you,but your record and your apat commitment speaks for itself,,put your name back in,,,dont let them wind u up,,, lol

pables

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Re: ENGLAND - WCOAP Team Championships
« Reply #23 on: July 22, 2010, 15:55:50 PM »
Steve,

make yourself AVAILABLE for selection, it"s hard enough for Brian to select a winning team without the availability of all players.

FWIW I"m a fish so am not available for probably a bad selection  :)
« Last Edit: July 22, 2010, 16:02:28 PM by pables »
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Paulie_D

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Re: ENGLAND - WCOAP Team Championships
« Reply #24 on: July 22, 2010, 15:58:59 PM »

Best players should play,,end of !!!,,,,and im sure the captains will pick what they think is the best team,,,,steve,,i dont know you,but your record and your apat commitment speaks for itself,,put your name back in,,,dont let them wind u up,,, lol


Someone help him tell the difference between "," and "." please!

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pables

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Re: ENGLAND - WCOAP Team Championships
« Reply #25 on: July 22, 2010, 16:05:56 PM »


Someone help him tell the difference between "," and "." please!

My eyes are bleeding.


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MintTrav

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Re: ENGLAND - WCOAP Team Championships
« Reply #26 on: July 22, 2010, 16:33:18 PM »

So should England get 2 football teams in the World Cup to give them a better chance at winning that too?


Do you think that would improve their chances?
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Paulie_D

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Re: ENGLAND - WCOAP Team Championships
« Reply #27 on: July 22, 2010, 16:38:59 PM »


So should England get 2 football teams in the World Cup to give them a better chance at winning that too?


Do you think that would improve their chances?


Only if they could get all 22 players on the pitch at the same time.
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Swinebag

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Re: ENGLAND - WCOAP Team Championships
« Reply #28 on: July 22, 2010, 16:57:46 PM »
disappointed that you have dropped out, steve and am posting to ask you to reconsider. I"m sure Brian will as well.

People really need to get a grip with this event

My various opinions on this are a bit of a ramble so I will number them (coz I is a maffs teacher init)

1. Selection Criteria - really glad that this has been canned. Running good in the few APAT MTT events that have taken place this year is no justification for playing in a team event. It should only be a consideration so that people following the event, may know a few names. The format is full ring and HU STTs, so players wanting to play would be expected to have evidence of proficiency in that format of the game. The only real evidence is from online play, which is unfair on live "specialists" but given the number of comps online players play compared to live players and the lack of difference between live and online STTs, online records seem a decent way to sort out the many candidates wanting to play.

2. Old Pals Act - It is a bit inevitable that a bit of this will happen in selecting the teams. I remember suggesting the only Italian Player to FT an APAT event to Luca last year after he had selected his team and he had never heard of him. I do find it childish though that players use phrases like "clique", "closed shop" etc.. to rant about their non selection. I"m pretty sure every captain wants to win and should be trusted to pick a team that can deliver.

3. Players who have played before but don"t want to put the captain under pressure because he"s a Pal - dont know where this came from tbh, but IMO if a player is good enough then pick them - whatever their other history or background says.

4. 2 teams for England!! - I genuinely thought andrew was trying to yank everyone"s chain with this, but it appears he was serious (I levelled myself LOL). To say it is merely a suggestion for future consideration really overvalues the idea. I cant think of any sport which allows more teams than others based on population or participation. I dont remember China having any teams in the world cup let alone 2 teams for the qualification period. I know Bobsleigh teams have more teams from other countries, but that option is available for all teams, providing they meet the olympic qualifying criteria. To then suggest it for a game that is so reliant on luck and not see that it therefore doubles that countries chance of success is very blinkered IMO.

Bottom line (and I have to do it in his style)

Get BEHIND Brian. He is the CAPTAIN and NOT a figurehead. He is an EXCELLENT choice and we should trust him to do the job in ALL its capacities. If people are not picked, then FFS get behind the team

COME ON ENGLAND!!!!!!!
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George2Loose

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Re: ENGLAND - WCOAP Team Championships
« Reply #29 on: July 22, 2010, 17:26:16 PM »
Yeh Steve put your application back in so Brian can overlook it and drop you :D
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