APAT Season 5: Discussion

[Marty719]

The definition of amateur has def changed in the past 5 years

Not for APAT is hasn"t....Amateur does not necessarily equate to inexperienced or uneducated.

I"m a highly experienced poker player but my skills are marginal at best...ask anyone who"s played with me.

This is where u are maybe an exception rather than the rule.  The real difference is that more amatuers are actively studying the game at the minute.  I have send out 11 copies of the poker mind pdf in 24hours as amateur players are wanting to better their game.  Im sure that making money is a large part of why people are working so hard on their games.  At the minute, Im sure there are not many players that have managed to end up in profit from the tour, due to the fact that travel+expenses usually = 3-4x the tournament buy-in at least.  The fact that it is so well run, and the work done by Leigh, Tighty, Des etc is helping to have players coming back again and again.  I think its important that the poker side of these weekends doesnt get left behind the social side.

[Jon MW]

The definition of amateur has def changed in the past 5 years

Not for APAT is hasn"t....Amateur does not necessarily equate to inexperienced or uneducated.

I"m a highly experienced poker player but my skills are marginal at best...ask anyone who"s played with me.

This is where u are maybe an exception rather than the rule.  The real difference is that more amatuers are actively studying the game at the minute.  I have send out 11 copies of the poker mind pdf in 24hours as amateur players are wanting to better their game.  Im sure that making money is a large part of why people are working so hard on their games.  At the minute, Im sure there are not many players that have managed to end up in profit from the tour, due to the fact that travel+expenses usually = 3-4x the tournament buy-in at least.  The fact that it is so well run, and the work done by Leigh, Tighty, Des etc is helping to have players coming back again and again.  I think its important that the poker side of these weekends doesnt get left behind the social side.

I think this bit - "...Im sure that making money is a large part of why people are working so hard on their games.  At the minute, Im sure there are not many players that have managed to end up in profit from the tour..." - highlights the contradiction in your post.

Yes, people are working on their game to make money - but the fact that it is obviously very hard to make a profit from playing APAT just emphasizes the fact that making money isn"t why people are playing them.

"the poker side" of the weekend is basically the structure isn"t it? And apart from a tweak to the antes and a tweak to the payouts there isn"t really much to change there. So I don"t really see how it could get left behind.

[Marty719]

I did point out Jon, but maybe not in the clearest of terms that it is the way tournaments are ran, and the people behind it that keep bringing players back.  I do believe that making money is why so many "amateurs" are working on their games.  I think many of these people would like to have the chance at a +ROI after travel and expenses for an APAT season.  Im sure the games will sell-out regardless, but as I mentioned, think the priority of the weekend should be poker, with the social side coming after (to be fair - as long as there is a bar this side sorts itself out).

[Paulie_D]

I know a lot of amatuers who want to play higher buy-ins.

I take your points from previously...my comment about my skills was meant in jest. Of course we all try to improve over time...some do, some don"t but come along for the social side more than the poker.

There are larger buy-ins out there...we all know about them, some play them if they are rolled for it.

Des and his team know that many use APAT as a stepping stone to bigger things....they"d love nothing better than to bring in some of those steps themselves. APAT tried the "Pro" series..and with all due respect to APAT and those who took part...it kind of fizzled. I"m sure there were some interesting discussions in Des" office about why that was and what could be done about it.

APAT is what it is...it still has aspirations but to me the underlying rationale behind it shouldn"t change....bringing high-quality, relatively low staked, well structured tournaments to the market.

Anything over that is just gravy!

[RioRodent]

 I have send out 11 copies of the poker mind pdf in 24hours as amateur players are wanting to better their game. 

I bet the author is pleased.

[Marty719]

 I have send out 11 copies of the poker mind pdf in 24hours as amateur players are wanting to better their game. 

I bet the author is pleased.

Im not pleased!!  I got charged $45 for it and just found out it only costs $20.  Im a mug...

[Maylis]

I thought that when i started this season and the pro league was to be included that they were testing the name

APAT = "Amateur and Professional Association and Tour"

Dont know if ive just totally made that up or dreamed it up but im sure that was being used.

[Paulie_D]

I thought that when i started this season and the pro league was to be included that they were testing the name

APAT = "Amateur and Professional Association and Tour"

Dont know if ive just totally made that up or dreamed it up but im sure that was being used.

You"re kind of right.

A.P.A.T. as an abbreviation has always meant Amateur Poker Association and Tour...after all, you have to have the word "Poker" in there or it doesn"t really make sense.

HOWEVER, when the logo sort of changed to APAT with the smaller "T" was introduced and Season 2(?) evolved to try and attract a wider base  they needed some other form of words that sort of fit.

Hence, APAT also could be used to mean....Amateur, Professional, Association and Tour.

At least that"s the way I remember it....I think some of us kicked off at the time...I may have a root around in the archives for shyts and giggles.

[EDIT]

Here you go

APAT will never be referred to as "Amateur Professional Association & Tour" as "Amateur Poker Association & tour" had been previously. It will be referred to as APAT or the APAT Poker Association & Tour.  The logo text simply reflects that the organisation will represent amateur and professional players, and offers an association and tour.  

[TightEnd]

Listening intently everyone, thanks

links to the antes stuff were good


Methinks Maylis might be a budget setters" worst nightmare!!


("I"d like this and this and this oh and one of those and this and this and....."

[bigalhx3]

Id like to see introduced next season the bar to be shut before & during the competiton as feel those that drink at APAT events are over working the bar staff and the valet to a point that they might do themselves a injury or crack up under the pressure and end up in a mental hospital

YOU ALL KNOW WHO YOUE ARE

[jacklevel06]

Id like to see introduced next season the bar to be shut before & during the competiton as feel those that drink at APAT events are over working the bar staff and the valet to a point that they might do themselves a injury or crack up under the pressure and end up in a mental hospital

YOU ALL KNOW WHO YOUE ARE

Good point.  

[SirPercival]

Id like to see introduced next season the bar to be shut before & during the competiton as feel those that drink at APAT events are over working the bar staff and the valet to a point that they might do themselves a injury or crack up under the pressure and end up in a mental hospital

YOU ALL KNOW WHO YOUE ARE

I disagree with this. If there was no alcohol involved then people like you might actually win one of these things.

[WarBwastardo]

Yes, people are working on their game to make money - but the fact that it is obviously very hard to make a profit from playing APAT just emphasizes the fact that making money isn"t why people are playing them.

Nuh-oh, don"t agree with this.  People play poker because, while it is a social game, you can win money.  For any serious player, making the money places is exactly why they play APAT games especially as there"s a GUKPT seat on offer for the winner. And serious doesn"t have to mean hardcore pro either, just anyone trying to improve at the game.

APAT games for serious or semi-serious amateur players (which I think is the majority) are obviously not going to be the only games they play in the year.  The goal is to be a winning player at the end of the year from ALL poker not just the APAT tour.

I"ve never believed that people show up for these weekends purely because of the social entanglements.  You can get pissed and fall into water features with your usual circle of friends at home.  I"m speculating of course but I can"t see these events being over subscribed if they were all free-rolls but the only prizes on offer were medals.


The poker aspect of the tour must always be the priority obviously as it"s a poker tour not an 18-30s weekend tour group. But without contradicting myself, I"m not sure that always has to manifest itself in a beautifully calculated structure.

Structures matter of course, but I"m more interested in the events being held in the best venues with the most experienced dealers and TDs and nicest fixtures and fittings and wherever possible, waitresses that call you "Sugar" and wink at you, than having a structure that rivals anything you see in the professional world.

People wanting a one off tournament buy-in and a perfect structure are wanting their cake and eating it.  Cash games are for the structure-purists.  Tournaments were designed in the first place to encourage action were they not?  That was the whole point of the exercise.  The crap-shoot element was the main selling point no?  APAT games are also £75 games which is a lot of money to find on the floor, but in poker terms it"s mini-stakes isn"t it..so I think we have to be realistic about how long these events should last and how they should play out.

In summary - fast structures suit my game better.

The end.

[TightEnd]

After certain instances this past weekend in Bolton which hindered the official running of the tournament, APAT is considering a ban on alcohol sale during the hours of tournament play itself for next season

Thank you.

[duke3016]

After certain instances this past weekend in Bolton which hindered the official running of the tournament, APAT is considering a ban on alcohol sale during the hours of tournament play itself for next season

Thank you.

Quite right too.