888 terms and conditions - Inactive accounts beware

[coprey]

As I have explained in this thread, of course members are given adequate warning as we WANT them to re-activate. We want to warn them, and put as much resources behind that as possible. The key, make sure we have correct information so you can be contacted.

Gareth, You have indeed explained that players with inactive accounts will be given adequate warnings before 888 begin the process of emptying their accounts of cash.

I have been in contact with 888 over the past week or so, and to date they have been unable or reluctant (I dont know which as they simply havent addressed my explicit question) to give me any information about when or how I was contacted prior to funds being taken from my account.

Does this surprise you?

[monkeyman]

Tbf - I think the added value they will add to the tour this season will more than make up for this.

That"s the one and only reason why I talked about having a decision to make rather than just not using the site at all. I haven"t played on Partypoker since I found out about their operation of this policy, but if I"m honest, greed is likely to win the day over principles and I will more than likely play the rest of the nationals. I won"t play cash or any other tournies on the site though.

[Chipaccrual]

I"ve kept quiet on this subject, but I"m a little confused as to why anyone wouldn"t play on the site because of this policy ?

For those that it has impacted on in the past, I"m sure they are annoyed to have lost money, but as Gareth has pointed out, 888poker want players to play on their site.

There appears to be a few communication queries, that I would hope 888poker would address specifically to those players involved, but other than that, if you know you aren"t planning on playing on the site for a 6 month period, just withdraw your funds.

Maybe I look at this too simplistically, but apart from those that have issues because this policy has affected them, everyone else has been made aware of the policy through this thread, so should be able to take the appropriate action if necessary.

[Marty719]

I"ve kept quiet on this subject, but I"m a little confused as to why anyone wouldn"t play on the site because of this policy ?

For those that it has impacted on in the past, I"m sure they are annoyed to have lost money, but as Gareth has pointed out, 888poker want players to play on their site.

There appears to be a few communication queries, that I would hope 888poker would address specifically to those players involved, but other than that, if you know you aren"t planning on playing on the site for a 6 month period, just withdraw your funds.

Maybe I look at this too simplistically, but apart from those that have issues because this policy has affected them, everyone else has been made aware of the policy through this thread, so should be able to take the appropriate action if necessary.

This^^^^

I actually really like the layout of the site, and the customer service seems v good.  Think we should be looking to support the site as much as poss when they are throwing in UKIPT seats and other costs.

[AMRN]

Agree with Marty and Leigh, and yes I agree it"s actually a pretty decent place to play online poker (and really soft)....

....however, I think Col still has a legitimate point, both from an overall perspective, and also from his personal experience and impact.

Bit daft for people to say they won"t play at 888 on grounds of principle - seems like cutting off noses to spite faces me thinks.

[Chipaccrual]

....however, I think Col still has a legitimate point, both from an overall perspective, and also from his personal experience and impact.

Totally agree with that, and I hope it gets sorted.

[coprey]

Hi All

This thread was started to alert APAT members about 888"s policy to deduct YOUR cash from your poker account if it has been inactive for a period of 6 months. This is in the terms and conditions, but who reads these, right? Maybe in future we will.

Gareth from 888 management posted on the forum to explain that 888 where "forced" to do this under strict regulations imposed on them and that every effort was made to notify customers before any of their cash was taken.

I had cash and loyalty points taken from my account while it remained inactive, and to my knowledge had never been notified, so I put the question directly to Gareth and at the same time requested information about notifications and method of contact to 888 customer service.

There seems to be a difference of opinion regarding notification being given to players before their funds are taken.

Gareth made the point strongly on this thead that customers were notified before their funds were taken, as follows:

"I want to point out that before any deduction of funds from an inactive account (6 months without logging in) ever happens, we email the member numerous to tell them that the time is approaching (a month before the time)."

"I consider our process to be very fair and reasonable around the guidelines we are given. We don"t even consider an account inactive for 6 months, and all a customer needs to do is login in that period and this is never an issue. We notify them by email if this is ever happens."

"There is for sure email warnings at the very least, they run on certain days of each month. This is for sure."

"As I have explained in this thread, of course members are given adequate warning as we WANT them to re-activate. We want to warn them, and put as much resources behind that as possible. The key, make sure we have correct information so you can be contacted."

In response to a direct question as to whether I had been notified before my funds were taken and what method of notification was used.

I received this email from 888 customer service this morning:


Dear Colin,

Thank you for bringing your concerns to our attention. My name is Devonette and it is my pleasure to assist you with your query today.

Let me first apologize for the obvious inconvenience that you have suffered from this recent situation.

Colin , I am sorry to learn that you were not aware of our dormant fees which a deducted due to inactivity.

When you initially register to be a member on 888poker you are provided with a user agreement which you must read through prior to being provided access to our games. In effort to view the synopsis which apply to the dormant fees I urge you to select the link which I have provided and make reference to number 8 point 4. http://www.888poker.com/security-and-privacy/user-agreement.htm

If you fail to use your account for six months your account will be considered a "dormant account". The six-month period will run from the date of your last login to your account. In the case of a dormant account, the Company will levy a monthly administration fee at a rate of 10% of the balance in the account on the date that it became dormant.

Colin , the administration fee shall be deducted from the dormant account commencing from the last day of the sixth month in which the account is inactive and on the last day of every month thereafter, until the balance of the account has reached zero. In the event that you login to your account during the ten-month period during which the administration fee is levied, the Company will cease to levy the administration fee but shall not be obligated to return to you any monies already deducted from the account at such time.

Therefore, due to the above terms you were not provided with an email notifying that the percentage was going to be deducted your balance which remained.

We apologise for any inconvenience caused and trust that the information provided will be beneficial to you.

Should you require any further assistance regarding this or any other query, please do not hesitate to contact us.

Kind regards,

Member Support Representative
support@888poker.com
www.888.com

[Paulie_D]

I suggest that you ask Gareth to confirm internally whether email are sent or not NOW as it"s possible that their policy has changed since your account became dormant.

What you received seems to be a "standard" reply which would probably have been sent as an automatic response.

Certainly it would appear that their is a miscommunication internally at 888.

However, we are SUPPOSED to read the T & C ....if we don"t, then it"s on us...and we have to take the pain for not doing so.

[coprey]

Paulie, your assumption that this is a standard reply is incorrect. It is the third considered response that I have received from 888 regarding my specific questions.

Your suggestion that the T & C may have changed is a guess, and there is no evidence for this. 888 have not stated this nor has Gareth.

[Swinebag]

I am a bit torn here.

On one side, I like the software and the games (payout structure is a bit lol but can let that go) and I will continue to play here.

On the other hand, I am increasingly frustrated by customer support and have now had a long running email exchange with exactly the same query as Col.

All I want to put this to bed is the following.

1. send me copies of the emails sent to me warning me about imminent deductions from my dormant account. I"m pretty sure I never received one but it may have gone straight to spam.

2. Send me a statement showing when the deductions were made and how much.

Is this really too much to ask?

[coprey]

Rob, I agree. The software is good and I like the games/structure. I also like that 888 are partnering APAT and I hope this continues. However this thread is about 888 systematically taking players funds without warning. The reply I received from 888 customer support states that I was not contacted, because the information is clearly in the terms and conditions (how many people really read the T & C"s?). Gareth (888 management) is adamant that 888 warn players before any such action is taken, stating that 888 do not want to take funds from "dormant" accounts but are forced to. It is the conclusion of this 888 customer that there is no evidence of any customers being notified prior to 888 systematically taking their cash and that 888 management are out of touch with operational activities and their own customer support dept.

[Paulie_D]

Colin.

You have raised your concerns which are valid (for a specific set of circumstances) but this thread is veering towards being just about individual problem(s) which is/are better left off this thread and resolved privately.

If you get these resolved by all means report back.

As I mentioned, whether the T & C"s have changed or not is irrelevant to the overall conversation as that is what they state NOW.

Anyone who ignores them does so at their peril.

Paulie

[Des]

The key facts appear to me to be:-

1) 888 are required to operate this policy as a condition of their gaming license.

2) All players have agreed to this policy in signing up for the site.

The points with regards whether we/they like the policy or whether it is commuicated effectively are an aside.  All parties have agreed to it and each must accept our own responsibilities as part of it.

That said I hope a positive outcome of this thread is that it gets communicated a bit more effectively.  I"ve certainly never joined a site thinking I"d be leaving money dormant in an account for over six months, so I can"t really see it turning players off.

[smithsj1]

I"m just wondering if anyone knows when 888 implemented this policy.

Was it there way back in 2005? I"ve heard complaints about it from threads in 2008 but none before so just wondering if anyone had a handle on when it came in.


Any help appreciated.