Author Topic: Re: Low & mid pairs (Read 8041 times)

HaworthBantam · « **on:** November 09, 2007, 21:19:36 PM »

Quote from: Bertie on November 09, 2007, 21:07:46 PM

I"m not talking about about if I"m playing and the flop comes a dangerous looking ts qh kh or something similar, but what if the flop is a messy looking :: ?

If there are only one or possibly two overcards, would you bet if it"s checked round to you? In late position I"d be tempted to check as there"s a chance of getting another free card and possibly making the set on the turn, but in mid to early position would you come out betting?

I tend to fold any mid or low pair if I dont make a set on the flop, but I can"t help thinking they could still be worth something (on a ragedy board at least!)

I would always bet out if it"s checked round to me, and if I"m first to act - a bet somewhere between half and two thirds the pot. My rational is that if players have called a pre flop raise (I don"t like playing unraised pots) then they are unlikely to be holding such pap cards, unless of course they"re holding a mid pair or overpair themselves. Betting out will give you some information.

Remember also, that by checking, you"re also giving free cards to your opponants.

I"m probably way off the mark, but I"ve found it to work most of the time......

Philippos13 · « **Reply #1 on:** November 10, 2007, 01:09:27 AM »

agree with Bantman, you can afford to bet on that flop, it depends who are you playing against though and perhaps for this situation most importantly how many players are you playing against...
now if bet and u r reraised it is hard to tell where you stand...
does he put you an AK AQ and he knows u havent hit and wants you to lay it down?
is he on a flash draw ? (probably with 2 overcards that makes him a favourite0 ?
has he hit the 8?
overpair?

So basicly bet out , i believe often u will the pot there , if you are reraised it is really hard to know how good those 66 are...

hope this helps...

Mutantbuddy · « **Reply #2 on:** November 10, 2007, 19:31:53 PM »

I tend to go with the question 3/4 pot bet if they have crap and you bet lower they tend to stay in with a smaller bet.The question bet usually gets the answer or the pot if your lucky.

UKChamp · « **Reply #3 on:** December 11, 2007, 18:59:24 PM »

Checking to see another card is an abolsute no-no. Your chasing two cards, there are many others, especially many other over cards, what do you do when they hit??

How I play the flop is dictated by what I can represent. Did I flat call late preflop, limp call early pos, call on the back of a bet and a call? Each situation paints a picture of your hand. I would suggest that you dont think of having a small pair, even when you do hit, but what you can represent.

Ambiguous I know, but I think its more important to play what your opponents think you have not your chasing a two outer. And certainly never check a low flop. Low flops, come out firing BIG, take it down early or find out where you are.

But then again, what do i know

AMRN · « **Reply #4 on:** January 03, 2008, 14:58:01 PM »

at the end of the day, you have a made hand, albeit a weak one..... the others may have missed the flop and have nothing but a hi card, and the checks around to you wouldn"t suggest otherwise. You have to bet here, if only to find out where you are.

Jon MW · « **Reply #5 on:** January 03, 2008, 19:39:04 PM »

I would go along with the plan to make a 3/4 pot c-bet.

If I still had a caller I would lay down the hand to a worrying turn if they bet.

But if the turn was a blank then I would hope that your c-bet on the flop could buy you a free card on the turn.

I think some people might advocate firing a second barrel, but I"m too cautious for that.

This way you end up seeing all 5 cards on the board for the price of a relatively cheap bet on the flop. If you"ve not connected with anything I would be loathe to call too many chips off with what is likely to be 3rd pair at least at this stage. If nobody has connected with the board then either somebody will make a sensibly sized bluff and take the pot (fair play to them), or at most you"ll have to pay off a cheap value bluff/bet.

This keeps the pot low - but you haven"t got much of a hand, and I"m sure there"s some saying about only playing big pots with big hands.

Jon MW · « **Reply #6 on:** January 03, 2008, 19:41:08 PM »

Woo hoo! Gold Member

HaworthBantam · « **Reply #7 on:** January 03, 2008, 20:12:09 PM »

Quote from: Jon MW on January 03, 2008, 19:41:08 PM

Woo hoo! Gold Member

Jon, let me be the first to congratulate you.

Another 139 to go for me.....

kinboshi · « **Reply #8 on:** January 03, 2008, 20:18:09 PM »

Quote from: Jon MW on January 03, 2008, 19:41:08 PM

Woo hoo! Gold Member

Jon MW · « **Reply #9 on:** January 03, 2008, 20:40:31 PM »

Quote from: Kinboshi on January 03, 2008, 20:18:09 PM

Quote from: Jon MW on January 03, 2008, 19:41:08 PM

Woo hoo! Gold Member

Nobody likes a show off

APAT · « **Reply #10 on:** January 05, 2008, 19:55:26 PM »

Quote from: Bertie on November 09, 2007, 21:07:46 PM

I feel I"m not getting value from my small pairs. I tend to play a strategy of seeing a flop cheaply (sometimes calling a small raise, but more often throwing them away to any show of strength)

I"m happy with that strategy, but then when the flop comes and I"ve not hit, I"m struggling.

I"m not talking about about if I"m playing and the flop comes a dangerous looking ts qh kh or something similar, but what if the flop is a messy looking :: ?

If there are only one or possibly two overcards, would you bet if it"s checked round to you? In late position I"d be tempted to check as there"s a chance of getting another free card and possibly making the set on the turn, but in mid to early position would you come out betting?

I tend to fold any mid or low pair if I dont make a set on the flop, but I can"t help thinking they could still be worth something (on a ragedy board at least!)

Taylor Caby, the owner of CardRunners.com, has produced a response on this question and we will publish it as part of our "Tips From The Pros" section shortly.

Jon MW · « **Reply #11 on:** January 05, 2008, 20:00:11 PM »

I was playing a limit tournament last week and got dealt 22 in the big blind, I called one preflop raiser to see the flop:

2K2

That"s what we want to happen when we"re playing low and mid pairs - it makes them a lot easier to play

UKChamp · « **Reply #12 on:** January 06, 2008, 14:22:03 PM »

Quote from: Jon MW on January 05, 2008, 20:00:11 PM

I was playing a limit tournament last week and got dealt 22 in the big blind, I called one preflop raiser to see the flop:

2K2

That"s what we want to happen when we"re playing low and mid pairs - it makes them a lot easier to play

The sick thing with quads is its hardy ever possible to get a decent pay off as your forced to slow play with a made hand early doors. The chances of your opponent connecting and having a hand of worthy value to call or raise are few and far between.

deanp27 · « **Reply #13 on:** January 08, 2008, 23:06:12 PM »

depending on your position also try raising small PP preflop to mix up your game and enable you to make your continuation bets more believeable when you have say 1 overcard to the board. Also this helps define what the blinds may be in the pot with also.