trip to Vegas - do I pay tax on poker winnings?

[troubled joe]

Please be gentle if this is a numpty question, but I"m off to Vegas next March and wondered whether the IRS would take their cut in the - unlikely - event that I make a bit of money on the poker tables (tournaments or cash). 

Info I"ve found elsewhere on t"Internet is pretty confusing and contradictory.



 

[TopPair2Pair]

If I were you I wouldnt tell them!!!! unless your planning on making a final table in a televised event.

[Paulie_D]

As with most things in poker the answer is..."it depends".

The IRS requires casinos to deduct withholding tax from "clearly identifiable" winnings in excess of (I think) $699.

Accordingly, because casinos don"t monitor your actual winnings in a cash game, you are OK there.

As for Tournaments then it depends on the casino. Most Harrah"s properties are pretty hot but again there are exceptions, including Caesars, I believe. Even when they might deduct the tax, they will, on occasion, run you through the necessary forms for you to claim the tax back.

Others will just pay you out in cash, or more, likely casino chips.

In case of doubt, ask the card room manager what the procedure is before you buy-in. I"ve always found them pretty helpful.

Good Luck.

[Jon MW]

If you"re British you won"t pay tax on tournament winnings.

It is likely that if you cash the casino will either give you the forms to fill in to apply for an ITIN number and you get your whole winnings there and then.

Or they will pay it out in chips which I think is the standard way of them avoiding having to bother with the paperwork for the ITIN number.

I think you would be unlucky to get a real jobsworth who insists on the with holding and gets you to claim it back.

[Paulie_D]

I think you would be unlucky to get a real jobsworth who insists on the with holding and gets you to claim it back.

A friend recently took down the $180 at the Venetian recently for $5k and was made to fill in the form and tax WAS withheld. Oh, she"ll get it back eventually but it does happen.

Then again, another friend won $9k at Caesars last week and got paid, in full, there and then.

I think you"ll be alright.

[duke3016]

I think you would be unlucky to get a real jobsworth who insists on the with holding and gets you to claim it back.

A friend recently took down the $180 at the Venetian recently for $5k and was made to fill in the form and tax WAS withheld. Oh, she"ll get it back eventually but it does happen.

Then again, another friend won $9k at Caesars last week and got paid, in full, there and then.

I think you"ll be alright.

The venetian is a bit of a stickler, however when Dan350 came second in their $150 they paid him in cash chips ($3k) in the card room so we spread the chips around and cashed in separately to avoid the red tape, other casinos don"t seem to be so strict. Or if you are on your own you could go a few times to different cashiers

[deanp27]

i filled in the form when i got there which was a real bonus as they with-hold on MTT winnings over 5k i believe (was the case in Caesars)

this gives you a great bargaining tool if there is a potential chop and a table full of US players who would pay tax, as in caesars they can"t change the advertised payouts.

Therefore if the top prize is over $5k, you can undertake to sign for first place and get a favourable chop.

it worked for me anyway.....

In caeasars just carrying the application form is enough and in one case i know they did the application at the point where winnings were dished out without with-holding the tax. The actual exemption form was on my doormat when i got home from Vegas.

not sure about others such as the Venetian as i didn"t manage any decent wins there.

My advice would be to apply ASAP and then you are covered if you do manage a decent tourney win

[Jon MW]

... The actual exemption form was on my doormat when i got home from Vegas.
...

That was quick - it took months and months for me to receive my ITIN number through the post.

I thought I heard you could only apply if you had a reason to apply - ie when you"ve won something, but in hindsight that could"ve have originated from adminstrators not wanting to have to bother processing your forms rather than the actual rules.

[deanp27]

when i bought in at the Rio for my WSOP events i filled it in there and then so it was over and done with.

Also overheard an interesting chat between Gus Hansen and Eli Elezra about a proposed home game whilst i was waiting

something about Gus not buying in for more than 500.......

one of the other lads had a decent win at Caesars and whilst they were sorting the chop they did his application for him, so i guess you can do it either way

[troubled joe]

Very helpful.  Cheers all.

[RioRodent]

Very helpful.  Cheers all.

Really?? I always find the threads on this subject really confusing.  

"You don"t need to worry about it"... "You should apply as soon as possible"... "They pay in chips"... "they pay in cash"...

I asked the question to Dan Carpenter, one of the Venetian TD"s, last year. He told me not to worry about it, they just pay out in chips, no with-holding... now it appears the V have changed their policy!

It also my understanding that you can not apply for an ITIN until you actually have a need for it... this came from a phone call to the IRS office at the US embassy in London... but then that was about 18 months ago.

The simple answer is that you do not have to pay tax on gambling winnings in the US... due to an agreement between the the UK & US governments. However, unless you have an ITIN (which is an Individual Taxpayer Identification Number, kind of like a SSN for non-US citizens), a casino may with-hold 30% of your winnings. They forward this money to the IRS and then you have to file a tax return with the IRS to re-claim it... at this point yoou would be issued with an ITIN and not have any probs in the future.

As already stated, some rooms will sort out the paperwork for you once you get deep enough into the money for it to be an issue, and then pay out in full.

My advice, for what it"s worth, is... don"t worry about it.

First you have to get deep enough into a tournament with a big enough prize pool that there is likely to be a problem... then there are three scenarios...

1. They pay you in chips or cash in full, with no mention of with-holdings.
2. They sort out the paperwork for you and payout in full. **
3. They with-hold 30%, which you then claim back.

** My second piece of advice... have your passport on you.