Fold pre obviously, but now... as played?

[pokerpops]

  edited to show cards - new Betfair HH are pants!


TEXAS_HOLDEM, NO_LIMIT, R5-77084987-1006     
played at "Hannover" for USD RM from 2010-08-24 11:10 until 2010-08-24 11:12     
     
Don"t have much info on villains, Izanagi 4bet folded to me when I had AA a fe hands back, and he also doubled me up with QQ on a AKQ3 board when my KJ found a 10 on the river.   
Zwgos hasn"t been with us long
HEM not yet set up after a major laptop rebuild
     
Seat 1: Mummytroll ($50 in chips)      
Seat 7: bowsan ($52.99 in chips)      
Seat 8: david3103 ($91.70 in chips)      
Seat 9: Izanagi13 ($164.22 in chips)      
Seat 10: zwgos ($51.73 in chips)      
            
     
ANTES/BLINDS
Mummytroll posts small blind ($0.25),
bowsan posts big blind ($0.50),

PRE-FLOP
david3103 calls $0.50, Q 10 off horrid I know,
Izanagi13 raises to $2.25,
zwgos calls $2.25,
Mummytroll calls $2.25,
bowsan folds,
david3103 calls $2.25. But now I feel I pretty much have to call and see the flop?

FLOP [board cards: 5D,TS,QD ]
Mummytroll checks,
david3103 bets $4, more?  I have two pair, but...
Izanagi13 raises to $17,
zwgos folds,
Mummytroll raises to $47.75 and is all-in, ......

[AMRN]

am i missing something? Can"t see your cards....

[SirPercival]

am i missing something? Can"t see your cards....

Don"t be silly Steve, seeing other players hands would be cheating  

[pokerpops]

edited

[AMRN]

definitely fold pre

as played, fair nuff to make the call when getting better than 3:1 - but be prepared to insta-fold if you catch the edge of the flop or miss completely.

$4 lead out on flop is just under half pot - i like the sizing as it tends to induce action...... and that"s exactly what it did!

With a raise and a shove before it gets back to you, I don"t see how you can fold. Just hope the raiser has AQ and the shover has KK/AA..... but given that you have chosen to play this hand at all, how can you consider folding when you"ve flopped apparent nirvana? If one of them shows up with a set, c"est la vie, and learn not to limp/call out of position with QT again!  

[Marty719]

blatantly obvious to get it in on this flop.  Like ur flop bet-sizing.  Pre-flop is awful.

[Foggy]

definitely fold pre

as played, fair nuff to make the call when getting better than 3:1 - but be prepared to insta-fold if you catch the edge of the flop or miss completely.

$4 lead out on flop is just under half pot - i like the sizing as it tends to induce action...... and that"s exactly what it did!

With a raise and a shove before it gets back to you, I don"t see how you can fold. Just hope the raiser has AQ and the shover has KK/AA..... but given that you have chosen to play this hand at all, how can you consider folding when you"ve flopped apparent nirvana? If one of them shows up with a set, c"est la vie, and learn not to limp/call out of position with QT again!  

Would not change a thing from Steve"s analysis..................Push

[deanp27]

don"t know where to start with preflop but take this as a general rule for 6max, don"t open limp. i"d probably just fold.

once you hit this flop i probably would check raise but don"t mind donking into the preflop raiser too much. now just get it in and hope the guy misses his huge draw

[noble1]

good hand to put up David lol , oop in a raised pot with QTo facing a 2bet and 3bet shove, wowser....
without a lot of info to go by meh the raiser i"d weigh more to AA,KK,QQ,TT from what u describe , he can fold pre to a 4bet [either he can bluff and know when to fold , or he can fold strongish hands because of reads on you etc etc] , it would help as to how he played QQ pre and post [versus your KJ] but from that can we put him on AQ knowing we hold a blocker??
The check shover no reads but AA KK AK mostly 3bet pre surely? QQ hmmm TT,55 AJdd KJdd J9dd [or same 2pair? lets count that as unlikely] weak non nut flush draws i"d discount without any specific reads especially after how the action unfolded....
Again no reads after the way u played KJ , i"m assuming after the river ten , mr QQ met not fold here with over pairs..
He covers so if u shove u basically risk $85 to win $135, [1.6/1 - 38% equity]

Hard to assign any fold equity if u shove without much/any reads/info to go by , so lets say non....
Best case scenario u face either AA,KK and shover has AJdd and your about 50% to win , if shover has KJdd u are 38% or 44% depending on which overpair, J9dd u are 38% or 43% depending on which overpair.. So a possible 7 combinations each scenario [6 overpairs and a 1 combo FD of some sort], 5 combo"s have u crushed QQ,TT,55 put at least TT,55 into shovers range [4 combo"s] so u have to at least allow 50% of the time shover will have a set where u are 16% ish to win..
Its to early for me to go through ev calcs for each so if any1 wants to work this out then please do , but at best this spot is marginal maybe slightly -ev , is it a mistake to go busto with 2 pair? meh , is it a mistake to fold? , meh....
At 25c/50c no reads, are villains good hand readers? if so they are not overplaying a second best hand, maybe one is at this buy in i would of thought, but both of them overplaying?? If u folded no biggie imo, if u called meh lesson learnt...

[LongshanksED]

IF I"m playing Q10o  pre I"m never limping (rarely do in any game)

As played you kinda have to go with it now and expect villains to have either over pairs, sets or KJdd

Beat scenario is obviously up againt an AQ and Overpair but your likely to be racing against the other with a flush and/or straight draw

[mousebob]

I fold.  
Behind to a set or going to lose to a draw!
(But then again I am a pessimist).
Save the rest of stack having not wasted much.