Author Topic: AK on the Button  (Read 4073 times)

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MintTrav

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AK on the Button
« on: February 14, 2011, 16:50:26 PM »
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deanp27

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Re: AK on the Button
« Reply #1 on: February 14, 2011, 17:21:09 PM »
Fold now as c-betting the flop 4 ways on that board should be strong IMO plus you have players to act behind if you decide to pull a move. Personally I 3bet pre as it looks like he is isolating the weak limper and thus a good spot for you to 3bet and either win a nice pot without showdown or take control in a bigger pot
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AMRN

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Re: AK on the Button
« Reply #2 on: February 14, 2011, 18:33:00 PM »
as played, fold now.... if it was HU, I might like to raise, but not with the other two in the hand, particularly when you"ve already labelled one as a station.

think I would have liked to re-raise pre...


WYoung83

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Re: AK on the Button
« Reply #3 on: February 14, 2011, 21:12:12 PM »
 Dont mind the flat pre flop, but if your instinct says this was a weird raise then maybe you should 3 bet to 6kish but as you say, i think your to deep to play for stacks. Most of the time when someone raises a limper they are just trying to isolate.
As played, Its  a bitch when one of the blinds peel, now the utg limper is never folding and the pot is big compared to stacks, and it is 4 way so hes not going to be c betting with hands that would fold to a shove from youself on the flop very often imo. I think i would fold now, looks like he may have you beat here.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2011, 21:15:36 PM by WYoung83 »

MintTrav

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Re: AK on the Button
« Reply #4 on: February 15, 2011, 01:02:32 AM »
So it"s a unanimous fold now. Perhaps you are right. Anyway, I obviously didn"t do that or this thread wouldn"t exist.
I put the original raiser on something but the other two on very little. He seemed as bemused as I was that he had had 3 callers and he didn"t seem comfortable. A re-raise on the Flop might well be called but I reckoned I could quite likely take this pot away on the Turn. If an A or K happened to come I would be pretty sure I was winning. Otherwise, I felt there was a strong possibility of taking it anyway. Flatting his 5k would really put the frighteners on him - so that"s what I did.

This is where it got interesting. The BB again surprised me by tanking for quite a while, looking me all over, giving every indication that he was going to shove, asking for a count of my chips and then eventually folding, causing some amusement on the table, but he hadn"t been joking. Afterwards he claimed to have had AT but to have been worried by my flat-call. UTG called without much drama. I had him on something pretty weak, hoping to hit. The raiser was now looking perplexed at the two calls.

23k now in the pot, along with the chip lead. Stacks UTG 18k, Mid-Position c 23k, Button 15k.
Turn  :3s:.
UTG again checked and the raiser now also checked. Back to me. I"m pretty sure the raiser is regretting making this into a huge pot and now just wants to get to the end of it as cheaply as he can. I can"t see that there is a made flush anywhere. UTG would have just shoved if he had been drawing for a flush and made it on the Turn - tricky he ain"t. If Mid-Pos had made one he may as well bet again for value, seeing as he keeps getting called so much. If I bet now, I might take it down; if I get called I probably have 14 outs with the 2nd-nut flush draw, along with pairing the A or K. On the other hand, as I now have a previously unlikely flush-draw, along with the A or K, I could check behind and take the free card. This may mean giving up on the River if I miss.
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LongshanksED

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Re: AK on the Button
« Reply #5 on: February 15, 2011, 10:03:28 AM »
Pre - reraise>flat. I"m I"m shoved on it"s a difficult call but probably a crying one with a flip at best. That said I font hate the flat in position but I"m prepared to dump if I miss

Flop - I"m giving up after it"s bet out to me

As played I"m taking the free card on the turn and if I whiff then I can easily dump it. Your at best the 2nd best hand at the moment. But then their is lots of other factors to take in. Like when you said one of the opponents looked like ge regretted making a big pot.

A shove may take it here, that would involve a deeper level of play that can only be utilised if your at the table but then the BB could be trappy with a set

AMRN

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Re: AK on the Button
« Reply #6 on: February 15, 2011, 15:13:19 PM »
Without other info, this feels like a great spot to semi-bluff shove the turn. Your flat on the flop has slowed the guy down from betting to checking - he clearly thinks you have something..... a shove now is believable.
« Last Edit: February 16, 2011, 08:55:47 AM by AMRN »

WYoung83

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Re: AK on the Button
« Reply #7 on: February 15, 2011, 16:19:42 PM »
 As played i would actually shove now, you are repping flushes and it looks like you may have it. You may get him to fold QQ here and if he calls then you have 15 outs.



bigredders

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Re: AK on the Button
« Reply #8 on: February 16, 2011, 00:14:00 AM »
don"t mind the call on flop....don"t like going crazy with AK

turn....absolutely shove!

TheSnapper

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Re: AK on the Button
« Reply #9 on: February 16, 2011, 16:00:33 PM »


It is a £50 tournament, starting stack 8k, plus another 8k for £40 at the first break, which has passed. Standard is generally pretty hot; quite a tough tournament. About 30 runners and only a few have busted. I have 22k, blinds 200/400.



Firstly, It seems to me that this is really bad game selection John. £90 to enter a tough field with first place likely paying ~£1k

On to the hand.......

This is a really good spot to 3 bet, raisers range is wide, we take it down pf often and maybe lose some equity but increase our stack by 14% and avoid creating tough spots for ourselves stuck between an accomplished player and a weak loose station.

We will sometimes find the top of his range (a talent at which I"ve become rather expert) and get 4 bet but with little or no edge over the field it is basically a flipfest, so embrace them. ;D

Flatting as you did is not awful unless you don"t have a plan or don"t stick to that plan. Floating the flop for 25% of your stack is awful and I much prefer a speculative jam over the top with whatever [equity + fold equity] we have.

To summarise...

Preflop, 3bet > Flat >>>> Fold.

Flop, Fold > Jam >>>>>>> Float

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MintTrav

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Re: AK on the Button
« Reply #10 on: February 16, 2011, 17:44:00 PM »
Looks like almost everyone is shoving the Turn, though they wouldn't have got themselves into this position. I didn"t really consider anything else on the Turn tbh. This scenario is exactly the reason I floated the Flop. I"ve got what I wanted when I played the Flop like that, so there doesn't seem a lot of point in changing the plan now. He has to put me on something strong and, as mentioned, the flush may already have come in for me, so far as he knows. And I have outs if I"m called. So in it went as soon as he checked. Win this and I"m chip-leader by some distance.

Kinda forgot about the UTG player, didn"t I? I didn"t think he had much, so would he call 15k, almost all his chips? Apparently he would. The Mid-Pos raiser was now in visible pain. He clearly believed he was beaten, but didn"t want to accept that he had put so much in and been called down and quite likely outdrawn. He slowly folded  jd jh face up. It was about to get worse for him (though not as bad as for me).

He was surprised when I showed my cards, but not as much as we both were when UTG showed .................  :as: 5h. The River blanked and the pair of fives took the pot. The JJ guy was pretty unhappy, with my play, the winner's and his own. I could hear a few comments between him and his neighbour about "they both called on the Flop!", which they didn"t seem to appreciate. They didn"t seem to distinguish that we had called for very different reasons. The BB (the AT folder) said that he thought it was a good move and he had put me on something very strong on the Flop.

All the streets could have been played differently, but I think the play is risky but okay throughout. I had a plan and stuck to it when the crucial moment came. However I think it was bad in one particular regard - not so much in flatting pre, floating the Flop, or shoving light - these at least gave me the chance of a big stack. I"m not convinced about jamming the Flop - it"s an option but highly likely to be called here, whereas the float looked much stronger and is much more likely to achieve a fold on the Turn.

I think the huge mistake was in trying that play in a hand against the wrong player. The two good players managed to get away from strong hands when they reckoned they were beaten, but the poor player just called with little likelihood of being in front. Tbh I had kind of overlooked him and hadn't expected him to call on any of the streets and, having seen his cards, wtf was he thinking? My own fault - I forgot about this:
you"ve already labelled one as a station.
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JStarkey

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Re: AK on the Button
« Reply #11 on: May 05, 2011, 20:05:41 PM »
He makes it 2100 because there"s a limper in the pot he wants to isolate. You know he is capable of making a move and you have near the top of your 3betting range so make it about 6k pre looking to call his Jam.

As played, just fold on the flop, 4 ways with that texture there are so few good turn cards for you.