New rules - APAT?

[kinboshi]

Rich posted this on blondepoker, and I thought it was very relevant on here (not sure if it should go on this board or in policy - this one seemed better).  He"s quoting the G/Grosvenor new rules that will apply from September onwards.

I quote:


"1. Players that are going to be late and would like to be removed from the competition MUST notify the Popker Room Supervisor in person or via phone prior to the start of the competition.

2. Players who have NOT notified the Poker Room Supervisor that they wish to be removed from the competition will be included in the competition, anted off and recieve cards until they arrive to play.

3. Players that have been included in the competition will NOT be entitled to a refund, and their stake will from part of the prize pool.

4. Players that HAVE notified the Poker Room Supoervisor that they will nto be attending, prior to the start, will be removed from the competition and will be refund in full including reg fee.

5. Alternates will be allowed.

6. New players/alternates will be allowed to enter the competition after the start. This will be allowed until the end of level two for freeze-outs or the for the duration of a rebuy period only

7. New tables will not be added after the draw has taken place. Players will slot into vacant seats on existing tables

8. Only new players are allowed to enter competitions as alternates. Players who have already played and exit-ed will not be allowed to re-enter.

9. Players may not play in more than one competition at a time

10. Players who pre-enter a competition and withdraw on more than one occasion, from the same competition, will forfeit their registration fee

11. Players who join a competition after the start will receive the same chips as those who began. However they will also be required to post the small and big blind in the first pot they are at the table for, in addition to the big blind if applicable"

How will the rule apply to APAT events, both the national and regional events?

[HaworthBantam]

Is this a change to British casino rules ?

2. Players who have NOT notified the Poker Room Supervisor that they wish to be removed from the competition will be included in the competition, anted off and recieve cards until they arrive to play.

[kinboshi]

Is this a change to British casino rules ?

2. Players who have NOT notified the Poker Room Supervisor that they wish to be removed from the competition will be included in the competition, anted off and recieve cards until they arrive to play.

Yes, new legislation.

[Paulie_D]

Is this a change to British casino rules ?

2. Players who have NOT notified the Poker Room Supervisor that they wish to be removed from the competition will be included in the competition, anted off and recieve cards until they arrive to play.

Yes, new legislation.

I don"t think this is new legislation per se (if I read Richard"s post right) but rather new rules brought in by G & Grosvenor Casinos because of the new legislation.

APAT Rules would, I assume, continue to apply to APAT events and where they differ from the "G" rules, APAT would, I once again assume, take precedence.

TK posted something in this vein on blonde (under his Vegas Diary thread) about the Gala in Leeds...

The Official line was this.

1) We cannot remove the absent players chips until the tourney has begun.

2) We cannot slot in any Reserve player after the Tourney has begun.

I accept 2) in it"s entirety.

I don"t accept 1) for a moment, that"s just ducking the "ever-so-easy-to-resolve-and-still-be-GC-compliant" issue.

Look, it"s just a case of saying, "if you ain"t at in your seat when the tourney is ABOUT to begin, your seat will be offered to a Reserve, & your money refunded".

If it"s that simple, why don"t they do it? Because it means fiddling with the names on the Computer/Plasma Thing, & that"s a bit of a ballache. We are increasingly ruled by Computer systems & lack of imagination.

Rather than moan, I try to "do", so I took the opportunity to make my point to all the Senior Gala Suits in Leeds. They apologised, & all agreed, & said they would do something. In fairness, with the new GC rules imminent, it will all change anyway, & they"ll have to mess with the PC & Plasma details if they are acceptting alternates, so it"s all a bit academic right now.

We had precisely the same problem in APAT Live Events,. They are always sold out, there are always 1 or 2 no-shows, & there are always folks hanging around awaiting a spare seat. So we give a 5, 3 & 1 minute warning, "if you are not in your seat in 5/3/1 minutes, your seat will go to a Reserve". Once the time is up, we have the reserves stood on the Rail "just in case",  beckon them to their seat (we have their names all sorted in readiness), and then we shuffle up & deal. And it"s harder for APAT, because our Events start at the scheduled time. I did the same thing at the Sky Live Tourney at The Broadway. And that started on time.

It"s about looking after the Client. (That"s us poker players).

Fair play to Gala, they accepted fully my point.

Des?

[kinboshi]

Of course, Rich was referring to the G/Grosvenor rules that only can come into force because of the new legislation.

Before the new legislation, those rules would have been unenforceable, as they"d be illegal.  I think most (if not all) card rooms in the UK will be changing their own rules in light of the new legislation.

I"m sure APAT would like to change the existing APAT rules that were restricted by UK law.  For example, in the Irish event the rules were different because players didn"t have to be seated (i.e. in the casino) for the kick-off, as Ireland has different laws in this area.  If I remember rightly, someone was travelling from the south coast to the Scottish event, but due to ridiculous delays, they missed the start. So they couldn"t play.  APAT don"t want this to happen, surely.

With regards to the Gala case - I think you"ll find that will change when the new legislation comes into play.

[Paulie_D]

Of course, Rich was referring to the G/Grosvenor rules that only can come into force because of the new legislation.

Before the new legislation, those rules would have been unenforceable, as they"d be illegal.  I think most (if not all) card rooms in the UK will be changing their own rules in light of the new legislation.

...thanks..I see. Are any of APAT's Tourney rules non-compliant?

I"m sure APAT would like to change the existing APAT rules that were restricted by UK law.  For example, in the Irish event the rules were different because players didn"t have to be seated (i.e. in the casino) for the kick-off, as Ireland has different laws in this area.  If I remember rightly, someone was travelling from the south coast to the Scottish event, but due to ridiculous delays, they missed the start. So they couldn"t play.  APAT don"t want this to happen, surely.

Actually, my guess is that APAT would prefer to have enforced the UK "rules" in Ireland and insisted that everyone be seated for the start, but I take your point.

As for the unlucky person in Scotland, I wasn"t there and so I don"t know the circumstances.

Unfortunate, of course, but rules are there for a reason. In the case of unforseeable events, some flexibility could be allowed. Did he get his entry back?

[kinboshi]

They won"t be, but the change means that the APAT rules can now also be changed.

I"m sure APAT would like to change the existing APAT rules that were restricted by UK law.  For example, in the Irish event the rules were different because players didn"t have to be seated (i.e. in the casino) for the kick-off, as Ireland has different laws in this area.  If I remember rightly, someone was travelling from the south coast to the Scottish event, but due to ridiculous delays, they missed the start. So they couldn"t play.  APAT don"t want this to happen, surely.

Actually, my guess is that APAT would prefer to have enforced the UK "rules" in Ireland and insisted that everyone be seated for the start, but I take your point.

I think I might have spoken to Des and Tikay about this in the past, and I"m sure they were both frustrated with the rules regarding being there at the start.  I"m not sure if any other country has this rule other than the UK?  I"m sure you"ll find they"re in favour of a bit of flexibility.

As for the unlucky person in Scotland, I wasn"t there and so I don"t know the circumstances.

Unfortunate, of course, but rules are there for a reason. In the case of unforseeable events, some flexibility could be allowed. Did he get his entry back?

He got it back, of that I have no doubt.  But he won"t have got anything back from his flight, hotels, etc.  I don"t think he was more than 30 minutes later either (but I could be wrong).