Hmmmmm

[Pilf]

Also, Leigh. Could you point me in the direction of the rules on the website please?
Haven"t really played since season 1 and could do with a read through before I set off to Walsall.

Thanks a lot mate.

[Chipaccrual]

Also, Leigh. Could you point me in the direction of the rules on the website please?
Haven"t really played since season 1 and could do with a read through before I set off to Walsall.

Thanks a lot mate.

Standard rule are under Association on the menu.

[monkeyman]

Sorry to be a pain Leigh, but I wholeheartedly disagree with you on this one. As I mentioned in my last post, the APAT rule regarding the transfer of seats clearly talks about "Value" and not "Purchase price". Allowing transactions which include anything other than the purchase price (in this case a slice of the purchaser"s potential winnings) is therefore in contravention of both the letter and spirit of the rule in question.  

[CrizzyConnor]

If you choose to swap % with players in the same competition or whatever then that"s fine and part of everyday poker but selling a seat with the promise of % as a sweetener to intice the transaction is wrong in my opinion...

Why is this fine then?? APAT clearly has a rule stating that no deals are allowed in APAT tournaments. This would IMO constitute a deal.

FWIW I agree that this is fine, but if we look at the rules in Black and White as we appear to be doing, how is it fine?

While it may constitute some sort of a deal to swap % with mates prior to a tournament I personally interpret the APAT rule to mean no deals at the final table etc. I thought it was so people PLAYED it out to the end for the win and the best (or luckiest) player wins. I personally felt this rule was in place to ensure the integrity of the APAT championship and champions.

I still feel swaping ticket for £75 + % of a player is selling the seat over it"s original value. Nobody can deny that it"s being used as a sweetener and is working. Where will it end - is there going to be a limit on the % you can offer? What about Mr X, the guy who doesn"t care about £ and only wants the experience, could he say feck it and offer to buy a seat for £75 + 100% of any winnings he might recieve in exchange? Surely that would be putting other potential buyers at a massive disadvantage of gaining a seat and you can"t deny that is massive added value? Yes it"s an extreme and unlikely scenario but it could very well happen. There are definitely people out there who play in APAT events and don"t care about the money... so where does it stop?

[Chipaccrual]

Offering a % of yourself to get a ticket, just shows how keen you are to play.

And offering a premium above the value of a concert ticket just shows how keen you are to see the concert, it doesn"t stop the person you"re dealing with being a tout

I really think suggesting that the seat exchange on APAT is like ticket touting is a bit out of order and I would ask you to retract that statement.

We can appreciate people"s frustrations at wanting a seat, but numbers are restricted.  The transactions that take place on the seat exchange are for a monetary value of £75.  At that moment in time, no one is making a profit from the transaction.  If players are prepared to give a % of themselves when looking for a seat, then that is fine.  (Bearing in mind, 90% of the time that will be worth nothing).

I cannot see how that can be abused.  Is anyone really going to go to the trouble of getting a seat, just to sell it for what they paid for it, with the chance of some cash if that person does well ?

Whereas if we were to allow seats to be sold for above £75, then that is open for abuse as you create a situation where someone can make easy money by getting the seat for £75 and selling it for instant profit, which would not be good for APAT or the players.

[STEVEFRYER]

I really think suggesting that the seat exchange on APAT is like ticket touting is a bit out of order and I would ask you to retract that statement.

I do retract, I have hopefully kept this discussion light hearted other than that final statement and gladly and willingly retract it

[kinboshi]

PILF!!  Great to see you back.  You playing the live events this season?  

I"ll have a percentage of you...

[Chipaccrual]

I really think suggesting that the seat exchange on APAT is like ticket touting is a bit out of order and I would ask you to retract that statement.

I do retract, I have hopefully kept this discussion light hearted other than that final statement and gladly and willingly retract it

Many thanks.

I think you can safely say, that from this thread, discussions will be had behind the scenes to make sure that it is as fair a situation for all involved.

Leigh

[Chipaccrual]

PILF!!  Great to see you back.  You playing the live events this season?  

I"ll have a percentage of you...

Timing is everything.  

[APAT]

I"m with Leigh on this and cannot believe the amount of energy being spent on this thread.  Any added percentage is wholly theoretical (and almost for entertainment value for the poor blighter who has had to give his seat up), whereas 15% of a car would clearly add to the face value of the tournament seat. 

If 21st century touts have stooped to clickfesting into a £75 APAT event, followed by processing a series of emails and posts to pass the seat on for 15% of a 1% shot that your stoolie will win a 200 runner event, then that particular industry is not progressing.  

[APAT]

I meant to ask......what type of car are we talking about?  

[monkeyman]

Maybe we should look at changing the wording of the rule in question then.
  My final word on the subject

[APAT]

Maybe we should look at changing the wording of the rule in question then.
  My final word on the subject

Don"t let it be your final word.  What would you propose the wording should be?

[kinboshi]

Imagine if Ian buys a seat with the promise of a percentage of his winnings... Trading Standards will be brought in.

(Only joking sir)

[Chipaccrual]

Maybe we should look at changing the wording of the rule in question then.
  My final word on the subject

Don"t let it be your final word.  What would you propose the wording should be?

Did you have to ask ?

He"s already admitted to being a pain, now you really want his opinion.

I guarantee it will be poetic and rhyme.