Author Topic: Post flop play - How do you play it and why ?  (Read 15577 times)

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mal666

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Re: Post flop play - How do you play it and why ?
« Reply #15 on: March 23, 2009, 12:44:10 PM »
 ad ah
he binked the  ac or :as:


Chipaccrual

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Re: Post flop play - How do you play it and why ?
« Reply #16 on: March 23, 2009, 12:50:20 PM »
Chipaccrual: shows [9c 9h]

Big4390: shows [ ah  ks]


*** TURN *** [7s 9s  :3s:] [5s]

*** RIVER *** [7s 9s :3s: 5s] [qh]

*** SHOW DOWN ***

Chipaccrual: shows [9c 9h] (three of a kind, Nines)
Big4390: shows [ah ks] (a flush, King high)
Big4390 collected 41250 from pot


I thought the reraise allin would have scared him off of it, once I knew his cards, but I guess he"s about 2:1 to win the hand after the flop, so obviously fancied his chances.

I don"t think I would have played it any different if it came up again even if it was two hours into a decent tourney.


Cheers for the comments guys.   ;D

I"m guessing I"m not the only one who would have lost all his chips here then ?

bigredders

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Re: Post flop play - How do you play it and why ?
« Reply #17 on: March 23, 2009, 13:13:05 PM »

Chipaccrual: shows [9c 9h]

Big4390: shows [ ah  ks]


*** TURN *** [7s 9s  :3s:] [5s]

*** RIVER *** [7s 9s :3s: 5s] [qh]

*** SHOW DOWN ***

Chipaccrual: shows [9c 9h] (three of a kind, Nines)
Big4390: shows [ah ks] (a flush, King high)
Big4390 collected 41250 from pot


I thought the reraise allin would have scared him off of it, once I knew his cards, but I guess he"s about 2:1 to win the hand after the flop, so obviously fancied his chances.

I don"t think I would have played it any different if it came up again even if it was two hours into a decent tourney.


Cheers for the comments guys.   ;D

I"m guessing I"m not the only one who would have lost all his chips here then ?


wow he didnt just get married to this, he had the ball and chain, was under the thumb and any other expression anybody else can muster up! ;D

in a word yes!

noble1

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Re: Post flop play - How do you play it and why ?
« Reply #18 on: March 23, 2009, 13:45:03 PM »
Unlucky sir , had you seen him in any hands prior to this?

Now that you have an idea of his possible ranges/style would you honestly play it the same from out of position?

Quote
I thought the reraise allin would have scared him off of it, once I knew his cards, but I guess he"s about 2:1 to win the hand after the flop, so obviously fancied his chances.


forget that he had  ah ks and think it through as to how he"d play out his hand ranges post flop if you had chosen a check flop line... and keep in mind the pot size and stack sizes ...



« Last Edit: March 23, 2009, 14:02:50 PM by noble1 »

AMRN

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Re: Post flop play - How do you play it and why ?
« Reply #19 on: March 23, 2009, 14:00:16 PM »
If you had checked the flop, I suspect there is a high likelihood that he would check behind to see if he can hit his draw for free.... and once the 4th spade hits on the turn, you can easily fold your set.  Perhaps sometimes best to check the flop rather than lead out?

George2Loose

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Re: Post flop play - How do you play it and why ?
« Reply #20 on: March 23, 2009, 14:21:08 PM »

If you had checked the flop, I suspect there is a high likelihood that he would check behind to see if he can hit his draw for free.... and once the 4th spade hits on the turn, you can easily fold your set.  Perhaps sometimes best to check the flop rather than lead out?


Steve are yo not always saying don"t be results orientated? Don"t u think you are being in this case? Leigh got his money in good- the play with the Ks is pretty bad imo.

Plus the RNG means the turn may not have been a spade if they both check :D
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Chipaccrual

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Re: Post flop play - How do you play it and why ?
« Reply #21 on: March 23, 2009, 14:25:31 PM »
My thoughts were that after his initial raise, he"s on an over pair, possibly with a spade.

So, my chips are going in fairly good here and a double up puts me in a comfortable position for the middle phase of the tournament to try and build my stack.

I"m just putting it down as the guy got lucky.  I"m pretty sure I would make the same play again as more often than not, unless he"s already made his flush, I am going to take down the hand, either at showdown or he will fold before.

I think that makes sense.   ;D

kinboshi

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Re: Post flop play - How do you play it and why ?
« Reply #22 on: March 23, 2009, 14:35:01 PM »


Very little reads I"m afraid.  Hade been at the table for about 20-25 mins, so didn"t really have much to offer.  Most of you seem to be saying, caution, but try to get your chips in.   ;D

Here"s what happened.

*** FLOP *** [7s 9s  :3s:]

Chipaccrual: bets 3200

Big4390: raises 5950 to 9150

Chipaccrual: raises 11279 to 20429 and is all-in

Big4390: calls 9050 and is all-in

Uncalled bet (2229) returned to Chipaccrual



I"m now curious as to what Noble1 thinks the guy is holding as he has played him on Tilt a bit.  Anyone else want to offer suggestions before I reveal ?


without knowing his image of you leigh its hard to say but this is a rather large re-raise ....
A over pair fits with a spade  - he has u for a bluff , flush draw or a set which he has to consider [a bigger pair here with a spade would be a 2/1 dog but he has decided to get groovy and go with it [stack size calls for it]..  or maybe a made flush but not the nuts ..
If your image to him his a weak post flop player then he might of got jiggy with 2 high over cards and has tried to muscle you off ..

TBH given i have labeled him tight conservative and you have chosen a lead out line and given that you have around 22bb back i would fold , lick my wounds and give him credit for a made flush....


I"m not sure I"d credit anyone with a made flush there - yes, it"s part of their range, but so are a lot of other hands.

They"d have to be Mr Tighty, from Tightville, Nit County before I could narrow their range down that much.
"Running hurts up to a point and then it doesn't get any worse."  Ann Trason

Chipaccrual

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Re: Post flop play - How do you play it and why ?
« Reply #23 on: March 23, 2009, 14:39:05 PM »

They"d have to be Mr Tighty, from Tightville, Nit County before I could narrow their range down that much.


lol, I thought Rich lived near Luton ?     ;D

noble1

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Re: Post flop play - How do you play it and why ?
« Reply #24 on: March 23, 2009, 14:44:57 PM »


If you had checked the flop, I suspect there is a high likelihood that he would check behind to see if he can hit his draw for free.... and once the 4th spade hits on the turn, you can easily fold your set.  Perhaps sometimes best to check the flop rather than lead out?


Steve are yo not always saying don"t be results orientated? Don"t u think you are being in this case? Leigh got his money in good- the play with the Ks is pretty bad imo.

Plus the RNG means the turn may not have been a spade if they both check :D


true its not a gr8 play in hindsight now we know his hand but we dont know how BIG4390 perceived Leigh...
This is not the best textured flop to see when you have top set oop and a tight conservative player behind , if we lead out we rather set him up to re-raise a draw which will commit him or we walk into a made flush or he folds 2 high non spade cards..
So whats the best line with 26bb behind,is it always correct to push our stack on the flop?

lol lol i was not joking when i said he is tight conservative with the odd move. he is as you put it a nit.Without knowing what or how he has perceived Leighs play up to now i think it is wrong to say he played AK bad..
But i do think seeing a turn card here is better,if your style is get it in on the flop no matter then Leighs move is ok ish.
On 1 suit flops oop i prefer a more cautious approach against someone who i know is generally conservative and i"m prepared to play the streets and reassess his possible range as the board played out..If we were in position the whole hand/situation plays out a lot different dont you think?....
« Last Edit: March 23, 2009, 15:08:05 PM by noble1 »

George2Loose

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Re: Post flop play - How do you play it and why ?
« Reply #25 on: March 23, 2009, 14:52:45 PM »



If you had checked the flop, I suspect there is a high likelihood that he would check behind to see if he can hit his draw for free.... and once the 4th spade hits on the turn, you can easily fold your set.  Perhaps sometimes best to check the flop rather than lead out?


Steve are yo not always saying don"t be results orientated? Don"t u think you are being in this case? Leigh got his money in good- the play with the Ks is pretty bad imo.

Plus the RNG means the turn may not have been a spade if they both check :D


true its not a gr8 play in hindsight now we know his hand but we dont know how BIG4390 perceived Leigh...
This is not the best textured flop to see when you have top set oop and a tight conservative player behind , if we lead out we rather set him up to re-raise a draw which will commit him or we walk into a made flush or he folds 2 high non spade cards..
So whats the best line with 26bb behind,is it always correct to push our stack on the flop?




Why don"t you want the money in here when he has the bare flush draw?
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noble1

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Re: Post flop play - How do you play it and why ?
« Reply #26 on: March 23, 2009, 15:12:30 PM »
didnt know i had posted it? anyhows my edited version is above george ...

by the way APAT i hate the black numbers at the bottom any chance changing them to say white?

noble1

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Re: Post flop play - How do you play it and why ?
« Reply #27 on: March 23, 2009, 15:18:12 PM »
Quote
Why don"t you want the money in here when he has the bare flush draw?


because we do not what he has due to our position....we are rather hoping he has a draw..i just prefer to see a turn card cheap if possible on this type of flop and re-evaluate ... i"m comfortable with a 20bb+ stack...if the blind levels are about due to rise,i might go with it on the flop...all depends on how the table has been up to now and if i feel i can steal a bit etc etc .... like i said the only times i"m cautious with a set is 1 suited flops,straightening boards or some good conservative player is giving action...
« Last Edit: March 23, 2009, 15:39:58 PM by noble1 »

bigredders

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Re: Post flop play - How do you play it and why ?
« Reply #28 on: March 23, 2009, 15:24:50 PM »

Quote
Why don"t you want the money in here when he has the bare flush draw?


because we do not what he has due to our position....we are rather hoping he has a draw...


but surely you can"t fold to the possibility that he has a flush, so many people overplay overcards with the nut flush draw...this guy didn"t even have that!

I think the way i see it is that leigh did nothing wrong and the other guy overplayed his hand and got lucky, i really don"t think there is anything else to it?!

George2Loose

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Re: Post flop play - How do you play it and why ?
« Reply #29 on: March 23, 2009, 15:49:44 PM »

Quote
Why don"t you want the money in here when he has the bare flush draw?


because we do not what he has due to our position....we are rather hoping he has a draw..i just prefer to see a turn card cheap if possible on this type of flop and re-evaluate ... i"m comfortable with a 20bb+ stack...if the blind levels are about due to rise,i might go with it on the flop...all depends on how the table has been up to now and if i feel i can steal a bit etc etc .... like i said the only times i"m cautious with a set is 1 suited flops,straightening boards or some good conservative player is giving action...


noble, you"re overcomplicatiing things. All your doing by checking here is having the player check behind you. If a 4th spade comes down you are very suseptable to  losing the pot even if he has AKdd when the 4th spade falls.

Your too shallow here to not consider getting your money in. If he"s flopped the flush- its a cooler and you have outs anyway.

As it is Leigh gets his stack in the middle as a dominant favourite against our opponent who played his hand pretty horrible imo.

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