AJo and 10 bbs

[WYoung83]

$20 MTT on stars, 5 places from Min cash, been playing for almost 4 hrs. Im obv not bothered about a min cash or busting before money, but wanna go as deep as possible.

Im in MP with 12bbs and AJo. Players behind me have me covered, I have a tight image and decide to ship it with Fold equity. Thoughs please, is open shoving 12bbs with a hand like this spewy. Im never going to raise and then fold to a 3 bet.    
Can i ever just fold pre here to conserve chips for a better spot to doubble up?

[mporter123]

Standard shove.

Usually flipping or behind if called but no other option.

[George2Loose]

Got hh? Sounds like a fold so close to money

[AMRN]

I would have agreed that it"s a standard shove every time, but then having read something that Noble posted last week about scraping into the money, I actually perceive the bubble slightly differently.... and there are circumstances where this spot with AJ might be a reasonable fold.

[scouse3465]

If on stars defo ship and hope kk behind cos the ace always comes lol
Would ship tbh to take blinds and antes and if u miss out on min cash such is life .
If you get it threw which is likely u upto 14-15ish blinds which is better to wait for better spot than getting blinded away.
If you wait for better spot u prob end up shipping for less blinds and worse hand. But if you reeally want min cash fold and knowing u prob dont , did you ship and i guess u ran into bigger hand and lost hence the post ?

[deanp27]

i"d shove in most cases but close to bubble i would fold

[mporter123]

Rightly or wrongly, I never fold in these types of spots, probs shove 88+, AJo+. Maybe more suited aces + smaller pairs.

Is there a correct shoving range this close to the bubble? Assuming reads as stated in OP.

[Swinebag]

I"m pretty sure I"d shove here

would like to see the argument for folding into the money here.

In a stars $20 tourney, this bubble will break pretty quickly, within an orbit I suppose, so you would still have a decent open shoving stack.

[deanp27]

I"m pretty sure I"d shove here

would like to see the argument for folding into the money here.

In a stars $20 tourney, this bubble will break pretty quickly, within an orbit I suppose, so you would still have a decent open shoving stack.

lol havent you just made your own argument for folding then Rob?

[Jon MW]

I"m pretty sure I"d shove here

would like to see the argument for folding into the money here.

In a stars $20 tourney, this bubble will break pretty quickly, within an orbit I suppose, so you would still have a decent open shoving stack.

lol havent you just made your own argument for folding then Rob?

That"s what I was thinking

Fold if you want to (almost) make sure of making a bit of profit
Shove if you"re really not bothered about a min cash

[duke3016]

Im obv not bothered about a min cash or busting before money, but wanna go as deep as possible.

Erm shove then  

[Santino67]

I"d be tempted to raise 2.2 - 2.4 pre with poss stop n go on flop if called behind pre, especially if you have a tight image at table. Think 12 BB"s shove is too big and could suggest desperate with open spot looking to steal.

[George2Loose]

I"d be tempted to raise 2.2 - 2.4 pre with poss stop n go on flop if called behind pre, especially if you have a tight image at table. Think 12 BB"s shove is too big and could suggest desperate with open spot looking to steal.

Do not do this. If you get called it"s a nightmare and if you get set in it"s a puke fold in which case your 12bb stack is now close to 9 bigs.

I used to jam these spots so often but you"re basically burning money. No one plays to min cash- but in an online comp ave stack is gonna be circa 20 bigs anyway so you"re only one double up from having a good shot. Fold to the money- timebank if you need to.

[WYoung83]

 Thanks for the replies guys. All taken on board. I decided to shove and got called by AQ and i went busto,

fwiw, the result didnt matter at all to me, and i would of started this thread weather i won or lost the hand. I just wanted to know if it was the correct play EV wise without beign results oriented of course.

[AMRN]

I played the Sky Grand Final, and found myself with 12x just around the bubble.........  decided that a min cash was irrelevant and that I was playing to win, and that I would take advantage of the bubble.... it folds to me in the SB and I shove and win, then next hand it folds to me on the btn, and I shove blind, get called, and lose.

At the time I justified it by saying I was trying to steal the (very significant) blinds and antes for survival.... but on reflection, just fold another orbit, still have ~10x, and be £300 better off.  The buy-in and expenses cost me just about £300, so yeah it would only be a break even result.... but I still had time to find a decent hand and double up, and the avg stack at the time was only around 20x. 

Whilst a min cash is not what we set out to achieve, the difference between playing for 14 hours for nothing, and 14.5 hours for £300 is huge - there is no other money jump that is so huge in percentage terms.  There is a lot more credit to a min cash than I had previously considered.  Therefore AJo in MP is a fairly simple fold in the OP situation.....